Hubei Province, October 2009

[shaun]

Ronan or Rob,

Please go over to Brett's house and give him a swift kick in the pants!!!  Good grief Brett you are overreacting to everything.  You are all over the place and without focus with her.  You need to get your emotions under control.  I can't even imagine what you are going to be like when the real problems hit.

Stop over analyzing and looking for problems under every rock.

Look;  Marriage in the UK? Not a problem.  Does not want parents there?  Frugal.  Wants to marry in a church? The wedding is all about her not you.  You will get the ultimate prize here.  HER!!!   She was planning the wedding long before she met you.  This is her dream and you are about to spoil it. Her parents pay for the wedding?  You better re-read some of the threads.

She wants and I-Phone?  Well so do I.  She wants babies?  Normal.

If you aren't careful you will spend the rest of your life wondering how it could have been.  Give it up you are not going to be the first man to do this on the cheap.  Not going to happen.  She is not being extravigant.  Again go back and read.  She does not even begin to approach some of the gold diggers we've heard about.

One thing I will agree with.  She is about to get you.  She is about to get you very happy if you will let her.

Shaun

[brett]

Thanks Shaun. Keep the comments coming everyone. I am observing the 96 hour rule on this. Actually re-reading my lady's EMF it doesn't sound quite so bad. But my male intuition is still suspicious about her. My next EMF is going to be very tough reading for her. But I am looking for the woman who might be the mother of my children. I need to see beyond the fluffy romantic stuff and make sure I am doing the right thing for both of us.

My well travelled cynical friend is right. As wealthy western men we are totally in the driving seat and we must have the final say on anything to do with these women :icon_cool:.

[victor-hills]

Geez brett remember its a two way street you saying you must have the final say on anything to do with (these women) not really nice way of putting things is it,im really lost with the way you talk about them and you saying about the bloody coat come on man its not like she asked you for the earth is it,if it was me i would not eaven given a scond thought.I understand you dont want to be taken for a ride but give her a bit of room to move.

my male intuition is still suspicious about her give her a chance brett i mean to say was you like this with a brit girl prob not so cut her some slack.
ps shaun and neil are spot on in what they say.

[brett]

Well I need to think about my latest EMF. A lot. I am being pulled in two directions. On the one hand, she is a great girl and I do love her. On the other hand, red flags are being raised and I have to be suspicious. Wanting to get married without her doting parents present, well of course that is strange. I guess the actual ceremony doesn't mean so much to the Chinese as it does to us, but I'm sure they would still like to be present. And I was rather looking forward to our Chinese wedding! We're unlikely to be able to marry in a church in the UK.

Yes it would break my heart and hers to end the relationship. But there are many women out there, and I want my wife to love me for who I am, and not for my wallet and Western passport. We need to build some serious trust in this relationship.

[shaun]

Well I need to think about my latest EMF. A lot. I am being pulled in two directions. On the one hand, she is a great girl and I do love her. On the other hand, red flags are being raised and I have to be suspicious. Wanting to get married without her doting parents present, well of course that is strange. I guess the actual ceremony doesn't mean so much to the Chinese as it does to us, but I'm sure they would still like to be present. And I was rather looking forward to our Chinese wedding! We're unlikely to be able to marry in a church in the UK.

Yes it would break my heart and hers to end the relationship. But there are many women out there, and I want my wife to love me for who I am, and not for my wallet and Western passport. We need to build some serious trust in this relationship.

Brett,

Those red flags you are seeing are not what they think they are.  I think you are obsessing over things that do not exist.  Back off and take it slow.

I think you got home, rested a little, and then realized this went way too fast for you, but generally with what I am seeing this is the way it happens. I think you are scared and you do not know what to do.  That is why I am saying slow down.  Take a few breaths.

You need to work one issue at a time.  If you are not ready to spend money on something just say I am not ready to do that.  If you are concerned about marrying in UK then discuss it slowly with her.  Talk about one stumbling block and the look for something positive about what she is looking for.

Shaun

[JimB]

Brett,
Trust is so very important.  If you dont trust her then it wont work and you will be questioning every thing that happens.  Go back and  re read a lot of these threads about Chinese customs and weddings.  Every woman is the same and every woman is different.  The actual wedding ceremony is not a big deal to Chinese women, the wedding dinner is.  It is not unusual for a Chinese woman to NOT have her parents there at the wedding ceremony . I am sure she has probably only read about ceremonies in the UK or USA and would like to experience it.  She will probably want a wedding dinner the next time after she goes home after you are married.  The custom in China is that the groom pays for everything.  So be prepared for that. If she only asked for a coat, that is not using you.  There are also the red envelopes to deal with.  If you do not know what that is, go back and read the threads about it.  There are at least 2 large ones i know about.  One started with me. That almost caused me to break up with my then fiancee. You also need to learn more about Chinese customs. I say again please go back and re read the threads about marriage and the ladies.  You know her better than any of us so only you can make the decision about what is going on, but this so far is not unusual at all.  You told her you would take her shopping, as far as I know every man that has gone there has done that. A 700 RMB coat is not that unusual.

[maxx]

Brett it is time for the tough love speech.You need to get the hell out of your own head.All you are doing is messing yourself up and over thinking this.Your going to crash and burn.Before you even know what the hell hit you.Come on man you strike me as a smart guy.I followed your trip posts.You were doing just fine.Your trip thread was well written well thought out.But when you comeback home.You think of these kind of things.

Your lady is probably going to want to have a party with her parents in China.And do the real thing in the U.K. like me and my wife did.Chinese customs yes the groom pays for everything to have to do with the wedding.You will probably get all the money back from the red envelopes.If not don't worry about it.My wife's family has helped us so much.That it is probably me that owes them money.

Are last trip to China.We payed for the plane tickets.Visas for me and are son.And maybe a couple of meals.And a couple of days stay in the hotel in Zhuhai.Oh and one of the tourist attractions I wanted to go to in Beijing.The stay in JiuJiang was payed for.The train tickets,Hotel,Tourist attractions.In Beijing were payed for by my brother inlaw and his friends and some of my wife's cousins.Hell it almost turned into a fist fight with the cousins in Beijing when they wouldn't let me pay for the meal at there restaurant.My in laws watched are son for five days while we were playing around in Beijing.They wouldn't take nothing for payment.When we returned from Beijing.

Brett anything you spend now will come back to you.As long as you take care of there daughter.So stop worrying about this little stuff.If your out 100.00 dollars for a coat.I would feel very lucky.If she wants a party in China and then wants a wedding in the U.k.It's all good.You bring her to the U.K. she isn't going to run off on you.Who does she know in the U.K? how good is she with the queens English?

Brett what the other members wrote here is right on.There is no red flags.Just relax and enjoy the adventure.Allot of these guys really wish that their first trip to China went as well as yours.You have plenty of time to plan this and work threw your issues.So I would suggest.That you take the time and learn some history culture.And learn a little bit of how your lady thinks.This isn't hard. until you make it hard.


Maxx

[Ming Zhi]

Maxx He is absolutely right, China's woman pure and simple ideas of sincerity, This is the way in China, less experienced, the West has already experienced , it required less.:fi_lone_ranger:

[Willy The Londoner]

If I was you Brett I would make some checks with the Home Office/UK Border force because I do not believe getting a fiancee visa for the UK is very easy.  In the US and Canada I believe they are but not for Chinese or Africans.

Of course they option is on the their website and they tell you they treat every nationality the same but they do not.

Some of the guys on here are acting a bit like Agency translators and seem to be pushing you for a decision - but that is yours to make after you consider everything you know about the situation - and you know more about that than anyone else.

To be honest with what you said so far I would probably be having the same thoughts as you right now.

I think I had better PM you privately.

Willy

[shaun]

Oh, come on Willy?  We wanna see!!!!! :icon_cheesygrin:

[Willy The Londoner]

Oh, come on Willy?  We wanna see!!!!! :icon_cheesygrin:

Maybe when the dust has settled.

Willy

[brett]

Hi guys,

Well I am still observing my 96 hour rule. But my heart says yes and my head says no. Am I paranoid? Am I overanalysing? Maybe. But something is not right and it needs to be resolved.

Yes I am very new at relationships. Some things I found natural, but others I do not. Some signals I could read easily, others not so easily.

Guys, this is more about coats and iPhones and stuff. Only I have met my lady. Only I know all the facts. Only I can make this decision. I have to question if I want to be with a lady who is uncomfortable with my putting her arm around her waist in a KTV bar. A woman who spends most of our precious afternoon together talking to her friends on QQ. Yes we had a good time together. Yes she bought me a cake and took me to meet her parents. But I still have doubts.

My lady has clearly tested me by buying the coat. I feel that I need to test our relationship. This morning I have told her via QQ that I have doubts. I will write a tough EMF. If we truly love each other then all will be well.

I now know that a terrible decision I made was not taking a human translator to meet the parents. That would have been very useful indeed. Unfortunately my lady's agency is not in the same province, so that was a great shame.

I must say though that come on guys, I am still only 37 (my lady is nearly 30). I am naive about relationships, average looking but fairly wealthy for a man of my age. I am extremely vulnerable to the wrong sorts of women. There are nearly 8000 ladies on chnlove. I have all the time in the world to find a good wife. Men get more valuable as they get older, women lose their looks. Time is on my side. This is tough but it is the truth. Yes we would make a great couple. But who's to say I wouldn't have as great a life if I chose Xia the shopkeeper, or Sherry the teacher?

Willy: thanks for the PM!

[Scottish_Rob]

God brett...HAVE you EVER read anything in Chnlove or through the forums...

Gheesus wept...!!!!

You were told (or surely read) that that the ladies do not like being intimate in public, this I presume would include the Streets and Bars.  The married guys will testify to this (kissing, holding hands, affection) IS NOT part of their culture (Much) in public.  And your NOT sure of her because she did not like your arm around her waist or because she spoke on her cell phone.  Surely you've read about cell phones and them too???

You mention "this is more about coats and iphones and stuff"...What did you expect to be spending your money on, TEA in the afternoon???

For me, I think it's your inexperience that's getting to you.  I think you went there, NOT too sure of this lady, saw what else is available and thought wow.  You seem to always mention that you kept looking at the other ladies.

As far as I KNOW (because I READ it somewhere lol) if the lady takes you to meet her parents, then your IT.  So stop analyzing and being paranoid.

[David E]

Brett

Those of us on this Forum who are still looking for that special lady would be sooooo happy to have her to buy a coat for !!!

How can such a thing be a show-stopper...it is nice to buy presents for your beloved...thats what Guys do !

You said several times here that you "love this Woman"...how did that suddenly disappear ?? Or do you now think that it was not love..or it was some other emotion ?

Brett, we are all vulnerable to the wrong relationship...doesnt matter about age or status. And we can all keep flitting from flower to flower looking for the impossible dream....I think the modern Western word is "committment phobia "

But of course, only you can make the final call with you and Ms XXXXXX

But dont keep her hanging on a string, dont make her life impossibly miserable by demanding this, that and the other in an EMF...be a bit gentle with her, she is also a Woman who has never married and would also have some difficulty with relationships...especially with something so scary as  Man from the West.

She has created a vision in her mind, maybe for many years as to what she percieves as her Prince, and how they will get married in this Fairy Tale...and what's wrong with that. ?

Dont shatter this lady.......or , as we say in Aus..."piss or get off the pot"

Relax, give it a little time, get to know her more and understand where SHE is coming from...or cut it quick and MOVE ON. She deserves at least that.

DavidE

[Willy The Londoner]

Kissing in public Rob, you are right there.   But for the rest - not sure you are right.

Holding hands in street and in public - always put a hand in mine - causes a problem with some strangers though  - they wonder why this foreigner has taken hold of their hand like the lady buying soap powder in the supermarket whose hand I took thinking it was my my girl behind me!!! lucky she just hurried away from the mad foreigner.

Arms around each other - thats ok.  None have had a problem with that when inside premises such as restuarants clubs etc. even in the street.

Visiting parents - do not count on that as a plus - two women took me to meet their parents and of the two I ended up without either.

I draw the line about buying things when they instigate the suggestion.  If you had a girlfriend in UK would you buy her a £600 plus coat? - the equivalent in China, when she has made no commitment.    Yes I would be expecting to be spending money on tea - getting to know her better,  not buying an iphone so she can spend more time on QQ and ignoring me.

I personally think Brett is being careful and may well have good cause to be.  

But as he said he is young and he still has a lot to learn - my God I wish I was that age again.

Maybe he should not publish so much personal stuff on this forum nfor us to all pick holes in.

He knows my thoughts on this.  

WillyDavid and the others

Brett has said it is not a question about the coat and other things she wanted.   Read his messages from the start.  From what he says he would like her to be with him BUT does she really want him.  That seems to be his quandry. And it would be mine too in his position.

I was in the same place myself and it fell through and I am seeing a parallel between my experience and his.

Give him some air gents.

Willy