Author Topic: Baby steps/getting started.  (Read 13064 times)

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trwme

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Baby steps/getting started.
« on: February 22, 2010, 07:46:03 am »
Hi guys,

On the 'Your Trip To China' board on this forum, I read the 'BEWARE-It usually does not work out the first time!' thread, all 18 pages of it. I've done a lot of reading on this board since I joined, and I found that to be perhaps the best, most informative thread I've read-so far, anyway. The intent and spirit of that thread basically is to warn and provide advice/guidance for first time visitors to China, as well as suggestions on how to be as prepared as possible beforehand by getting to know the lady you will be meeting.

I wanted to try to start a similar thread focused on the initial stages of contacting and getting to know the lady. To do so, I am going to put myself out there, explain how I've gone about things, and invite advice/criticisms from those of you who are far more experienced with these ladies, and in dealing with chnlove. This will all be done in the context of chnlove, since that is where I am coming at this from right now. If the moderators think this thread is redundant or inapproriate, just let me know and delete it. However, the chnlove setup is a new one for me, and I am sure for other newbies here. I think it would be good to have one thread aimed at this for new members to look at. Well...here goes.

Profile  What I did with my profile is this; in the very first sentence I stated I am poor. Now, I am not poverty stricken, or I wouldn't be doing this. But I decided this would help weed out the gold diggers and scammers to an extent. I reinforced this subtely throughout my self description. For example, 'love can't be bought or sold' and 'love doesn't need money to sustain it'. I also mention, without boldly proclaiming what a wonderful family man I am (lol), that I am raising my 6 year old daughter by myself. I learned a long time ago that a man raising his own kids by himself catches the attention and interest of women here in the west, and I would imagine that would apply (perhaps moreso) to ladies from a culture that emphasizes family to such a great extent. I tried to present myself as humbly as possible.

Contacting the ladies   There are three ways to initially contact the ladies-cupid notes, responding to admirer mails, or just directly sending an EMF. I'll explain how I went about this (so far) and why.

Cupid notes Someone on one of the other threads basically denigrated this way of making initial contact, calling it cheap looking. For myself, it reinforces what I said in my profile-I don't have huge amounts of money to throw at this process. If you do, good for you, go for it. But I am not looking for a woman who is going to judge me on how much money I can spend. I don't want her looking at my bank account. I want her looking at me, the person. I also want to know that the lady has some level of interest in me before I contact her. So I sent several cupid notes out. I can then look at her response to see how she fits what I am looking for-and more importantly, see if she took the time to really read my profile. To me this helps eliminate some of the translator scamming that is talked about on here. If she doesn't talk about my profile in a way that lets me know she actually read it, I am not going to respond with an EMF-I'll save those for the ones who show a certain level of seriousness in taking the time to read what I wrote. I've sent out 8 cupids, and only 2-3 appear to have actually read my profile.

Responding to Admirer mails Scottish Rob stated that these are all come ons from the agency, and not to respond to them. I didn't completely take his advice, but I did take it into consideration. Like the cupid notes, if the admirer mails do not address what I said in my profile, I will not respond to them. Very few of them show any signs of having read my profile, and most of them are obvious come ons. I've also taken to responding to every admirer mail from the Changsha P216 agency with reason A-the lady is not suitable. The photos from there are photoshopped to death, and many of the emails are more or less blatantly offering me a 'good time' if I come there to visit the lady.

Responding directly with EMF's as first contact This doesn't work for me, and I do not intend to do it, for several reasons. For one, I want to know the lady has some level of interest before I invest my hard earned money into getting to know her. I can gauge that with the cupids and the admirer mails. For another, if I just send an EMF I've wasted at least 2 credits before I even know if she is interested, or real, or maybe is already involved. For yet another, I can get a bit of a read about where she is coming from before I ever directly write to her by letting her either respond to a cupid, or by sending me an admirer mail. I can also tell something about the agency she is using in this way also.


So far I have contacted four ladies. One is a lady who responded to one of my cupids, one I am very interested in, who has been on the top of my list all along. Unfortunately, I contacted her right near the beginning of their spring festival, and as was suggested to me when I mentioned this on another thread, it took her a while to respond back because of it. She apologized for taking so long to respond, said she was still on her holiday, but had contacted me as soon as her agency had gone back to work. There are two other cupids I am interested in answering but I am not going to at this time. Both addressed my profile in a way that let me know they read it. One I like very much, but I am holding back to see how these other contacts go first. If the first round of contacts don't work out, she is at the top of round 2. The other lady, although she too responded in a way that showed me she read my profile (quoting it directly and commenting on what she quoted), I am not sure if I will ever contact back; her photos I am sure are photoshopped, and although they aren't the rolling on the bed in her skimpy nightgown type, she IS emphasizing her ample cleavage, at 45! Lot of purple eye shadow too.

The other three I contacted are from my admirer list. Two of those responded directly to my profile. Of those two, one I am on the third round of EMFs with, and there has been a good q&a back and forth with her. She seems completely genuine, and in fact her emails are saying things I could have written myself. The second of these two is going on my blocked list. Although her admirer mail adressed my profile, her follow up to my first EMF did not expand on that like I asked, she said some things that tells me she is probably a little spoiled, she is a little bit younger than my target age, and so although she is very cute I'm going to end that one quick, I think.

The third one I just contacted, and am waiting to hear from. Although she didn't really respond to my profile, I liked her a.m. and her profile, she fits the age group I am looking at, and to be fair to her I have expanded my self description since she contacted me originally-she was one of the first to send me an admirer mail, actually. She's kinda been my 1a all along.

After blocking the one lady, I am going to limit myself to talking to the other three. They are all from different agencies and different parts of China. Hopefully eventually one of them will stick out to the point that I will narrow it down to her, and focus on her alone-we'll see.

So far, this is what I've done and how I've approached this. I've also done the reading available on the agencies that chnlove provides, particularily checking the ratings, and also from reading what is said on this forum about different agencies. Like I said, I am avoiding Changsha P216 completely, and a couple of the other agencies too, based on this examination.

~Roy~
« Last Edit: February 22, 2010, 08:03:13 am by trwme »

trwme

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RE: Baby steps/getting started.
« Reply #1 on: February 22, 2010, 06:22:45 pm »
Some more things to add to my op. Again, just to put myself out there for the benefit of advice/criticism, and perhaps to help someone else along who is new at this, as I am. The first couple relate to the admirer mails.

Favorites list I figured out pretty quickly this is a way to fish for admirer mail. Whenever you add someone to your favorites, the agency they are in gets notified, and I assume the lady does too, through the agency. Several of my admirer mails came after adding someone to my favorites, and specifically thank me for adding them. Along with the cupids, this is a free way to attract some attention and possible future contacts. This requires a lot of looking at profiles. I generally go through my 'matches', skim the profiles, look for things that generally fit into the criteria I have for what I am looking for, and then add to favorites. They don't have to exactly fit. The better ones-the more precise fits-I bookmark the profiles on my computer after adding them. Because I've gone through so many profiles, and added so many favorites, this helps me recognize later on which ones I was most interested in. I have 272 saved favorites. I have about 50 admirer mails. Of the a.ms., probably about 40-45 came from fishing with the favorites list.

Refreshing your profile This one is a no brainer-they tell you about doing this on the site, if you are paying attention. The search engines cranks out profiles in order of newest profiles/most recently refreshed profiles. By refreshing your profile you keep yours on the first few pages, which of course increases your chances of being seen. I refresh mine every couple of days, or have until now, and sometimes everyday. I've also figured out that my admirer mails come about the same time every evening, so I try to do this refreshing about an hour or two before then. Of the admirer mails I've received that weren't gotten by fishing with my favorites list, the rest have been gotten in this manner, I believe.

Translators This is a big issue. I've taken the advice of some of the brothers here, and addressed the translators directly in my EMFs. I do this right at the beginning, before the part addressed to the lady. The translator is going to see the letter first, anyway.

On the first EMF, what I've done is thanked the translator in advance for the work they will be doing for the lady and I. I am also careful to show respect for the lady; for example, I'll say to the translator, 'Thank you in advance for the work you will be doing for Ms. Yang and I.' I never call the lady by her first name when addressing the translator. I also tell the translator that part of the reason I have chosen this woman to contact is the excellent reputation of the agency they work for. I figure this can't hurt, and maybe it puts a little subtle psychological pressure on them to do a good job.

On the second EMF, I'll tell the translator what a great job they did on the previous letter from the lady, tell them their english is very good, ask where they went to school to learn this, and ask their name. I'll then ask for their contact information in case there is anything in the future I might need clarified.

On the advice of some of the brothers, I decided tht developing a relationship with the translator is very important. The lady on her end is certainly developing one, if she doesn't already have one. That may or may not be a friendship on that end, but by assuming it could be or is one, I can hopefully gain an ally on that end of things with the lady. I could also make them more careful about the work they do. If I piss the translator off, they might be inclined to steer the woman away from me. If they see that I am genuine and truly respect the lady, she might work harder on mt behalf on that end-and may, hopefully, be more inclined to give the lady my personal contact info (and give me the lady's) when I've reached the point of asking for that. This is especially true if the lady and the translator are friends. I'm just in the beginning stages of doing this, and what I am trying to do has come from reading the advice and experience of the other members here who have talked about this issue. As the saying goes here, you can attract more flies with honey rather than vinegar.

Offline Willy The Londoner

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RE: Baby steps/getting started.
« Reply #2 on: February 22, 2010, 08:44:50 pm »
I like the efforts spent on the translator because if everything goes wrong with your eventual intended you always have somebody else to fall back on - or rather fall forward on!!!!!

Do not forget the translators are women who also may be looking for a man!!!   I am told they can get really lively reading some of the EMF's written by small number of men using Chnlove.:angel::angel:

Willy
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ttwjr32

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RE: Baby steps/getting started.
« Reply #3 on: February 22, 2010, 10:29:59 pm »
Willy   define really lively:-/

trwme

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RE: Baby steps/getting started.
« Reply #4 on: February 22, 2010, 10:41:40 pm »
Quote from: 'Willy The Londoner' pid='32319' dateline='1266889490'

I like the efforts spent on the translator because if everything goes wrong with your eventual intended you always have somebody else to fall back on - or rather fall forward on!!!!!

Do not forget the translators are women who also may be looking for a man!!!   I am told they can get really lively reading some of the EMF's written by small number of men using Chnlove.:angel::angel:

Willy


So far I have managed to start a bit of a side converation with two of them, and have their names. As I see it, it can't do anything but help to have them thinking well of you, and have them on your side with the lady. I think it can pay off in a few ways. As I mentioned, I am writing three ladies in three different parts of China right now. By the time I go, I'll have that down to one, and I won't be able to jet across China to meet one of the others if things don't go well with the one I choose to meet initially-even if the other ladies were willing to do that. So having a good reputation with the translator, I think she can point me towards other women in the agency and do a bit of matchmaking. Also, if it turns out the EMF responses contain a large bit of the translator's personality, well...that would mean the EMF chemistry is largely between you and the translator. And that leads into what you said about the translators being women looking for men as well, lol. You'd already have an established chemistry with someone there!

Of course, my main objectives right now is to have them do the best work they can for me and the lady, and perhaps be someone on that side of things nudging her my way, maybe assuaging any doubts the lady might have.

BTW, refering back to the 'BEWARE' thread I mentioned at the very beginning of my op....after only a few EMFs I can understand perfectly well what you guys were talking about in regards to how easy it is to get carried away. I am a newbie here, but I am a grizzled veteran of internet dating. And never in all my time doing this (or in all my life, really) have I ever encountered the kind of phenomena I am encountering now writing these ladies. It's amazing. I've always been someone who is in control of his emotions, sometimes probably too much so, but with these ladies....that is damn hard to maintain. And I can see a little bit now of what those of you who have met and married one of these women are talking about. As I told 007 in a PM, with one of the women I am writing to right now, I can very easily see me becoming her little puppy dog for the rest of my life if she handles her stuff right, lol.
Quote from: 'Vince G' pid='32304' dateline='1266845370'

Cupid notes,  If I saw a lady that I wanted to contact I would use the Cupid note. For I wasn't spending a credit on a "maybe". If she was taken, or for whatever reason didn't want to reply? There's no money spent on nothing. I couldn't give two rat turds on whether it looked cheap or not. If the lady thought or expressed why didn't I spend a credit on her? Then we would already be starting off on the wrong foot. She may or may not get a reply from me and she wouldn't like it if she did.

The cupid notes I sent basically said, I am interested in you, Can I write you? Maybe something from her profile was quoted? Each CN was written for the lady, not a form type. I found my lady this way and I'm glad I did.


I haven't seen a feature on the cupid page that allows you to write your own message. Maybe I'm missing it. All I get is a list of four options of things to say. I usually pick the one that basically says 'I liked your profile, would you care to read mine to see if I fit what you are looking for?'

Being completely inexperienced at this time about chinese culture, I can't say definitively how the lady may look at receiving what amounts to a freebee from a guy. But from what I've read here, frugality is or seems to be a big part of the chinese character, so it might have just the opposite effect, rather than turning them off. It might seem very chinese to them, lol. Of course, that depends on how they see westerners. Either way, I am not out to impress a lady by throwing money at her, even if I could. I want to avoid sending that kind of signal right off the bat.
« Last Edit: February 22, 2010, 10:55:37 pm by trwme »

Scottish_Rob

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RE: Baby steps/getting started.
« Reply #5 on: February 23, 2010, 07:33:47 am »
tr....When I mentioned about the responding to admiring mails maybe I did not come over right...

What I was trying to say was, that there is probably a high percentage of these mails being done by the agency, to attract your attention...Read and compare the ones you have received and you will probably be able to tell the difference.

I stopped answering those type of letters, unless there was a definete attraction by me.  Something had to 'Stand out,' as you said, 'Read' my profile and mentions someting from it.  I took the advice of Vince, DavidE, and others after reading some of the things they mentioned.  So I reverted to Picking the lady I was interested in and sent an Emf rather than a cupid note.  I found that this was a good way because 'YOU' are choosing the one and NOT the agency.

But good job on this thread...And the best of luck mate...

brett

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RE: Baby steps/getting started.
« Reply #6 on: February 23, 2010, 07:36:30 am »
Some good stuff here Roy.

Anyway, I have to stick my oar in...

Profile: Type any old rubbish, I very much doubt ladies even read it. What you should do though is have a good idea of the kind of lady you're looking for.
Cupid notes: Nothing wrong with these.
Admirer mails: I found my lady via these so again they are OK.
Yes blocking ladies you don't like is a good idea.

I'd also add that when writing an EMF keep it simple. Translators work long hours for poor salaries and anything you can do to make their life easier will go down well!

I don't think I would use chnlove again. Why? Well they've diluted the lovely chinese ladies with horrible Thais and you can't seem to screen them out. What a dumb idea.

ttwjr32

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RE: Baby steps/getting started.
« Reply #7 on: February 23, 2010, 10:55:25 am »
its like playing craps with these agencies you just dont
know how the dice will fall

trwme

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RE: Baby steps/getting started.
« Reply #8 on: February 23, 2010, 07:00:19 pm »
Quote from: 'Scottish_Rob' pid='32380' dateline='1266928427'

tr....When I mentioned about the responding to admiring mails maybe I did not come over right...

What I was trying to say was, that there is probably a high percentage of these mails being done by the agency, to attract your attention...Read and compare the ones you have received and you will probably be able to tell the difference.

I stopped answering those type of letters, unless there was a definete attraction by me.  Something had to 'Stand out,' as you said, 'Read' my profile and mentions someting from it.  I took the advice of Vince, DavidE, and others after reading some of the things they mentioned.  So I reverted to Picking the lady I was interested in and sent an Emf rather than a cupid note.  I found that this was a good way because 'YOU' are choosing the one and NOT the agency.

But good job on this thread...And the best of luck mate...


Hi Rob,

I probably shouldn't have named you when I spoke about that, it might have come across as calling you out maybe. I greatly respect everyone's advice here, especially those-like you-who have been at this a while, gone to China, and made connections or found their lady. I understand what you are saying. For me-in my personal circumstances-right now I have a limited budget for pursuing this, so I need to be as efficient as I can, even if it means sifting through the admirer letters over and over looking for clues as to whether they are real or agency come ons. That in itself has been educational, especially when I can apply what I have learned from the brotherhood here in doing so. I was also very lucky that I found this forum before I started spending money on EMFs. I can't say enough about what a great help everyone here has been. Because of all the advice I gathered from here, I feel like I was better able to place my bets from the beginning.

So far, so good. I am talking to three ladies I know are real. One was a cupid response, and the other two from my admirer list.

Quote from: 'brett' pid='32381' dateline='1266928590'

Some good stuff here Roy.

Anyway, I have to stick my oar in...

Profile: Type any old rubbish, I very much doubt ladies even read it. What you should do though is have a good idea of the kind of lady you're looking for.
Cupid notes: Nothing wrong with these.
Admirer mails: I found my lady via these so again they are OK.
Yes blocking ladies you don't like is a good idea.

I'd also add that when writing an EMF keep it simple. Translators work long hours for poor salaries and anything you can do to make their life easier will go down well!

I don't think I would use chnlove again. Why? Well they've diluted the lovely chinese ladies with horrible Thais and you can't seem to screen them out. What a dumb idea.


Hi Brett,

Well, I might have to disagree with you, respectfully, about the profiles. Many of the ladies profiles I've read specifically ask you to read them. Personally, I want to talk to someone who knows what they are looking for. If they are serious, and know what they want, then it seems to me they will read the profiles to see if you 'fit' THEIR criteria. I don't want someone who will take anyone, or who is just looking at who has the most handsome pics and assuming since I am from the west I MUST have money. And I know for certain that at least some of them do read the profiles; I know this, because I have several admirer or cupid responses that address things I said there and/or quote from what I wrote directly.

What you say about the translators though is something I probably should keep in mind. However, to play devil's advocate for a moment, let me say this. If I happen to be writing someone who is trying to scam me, better to make them work for it. If the pay is that bad they'll move on to someone that won't make them work that hard. BUT, again, you have a good point. I have started to build a bit of a relationship with a couple of the translators through side notes on the EMFs. Maybe I should try to find a way to make it worth their while, and ask if there is something I can do to make this easier for them. I do tend to write long letters, lol, a couple have been right at the 6,000 character limit-literaly!

But hey, maybe when the time comes it will give them more incentive to pass along my private contact info just to get rid of me!
« Last Edit: February 23, 2010, 07:17:39 pm by trwme »

Offline Willy The Londoner

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RE: Baby steps/getting started.
« Reply #9 on: February 23, 2010, 08:12:29 pm »
Just a word for those who write long long EMF's.  Do not waste your time and effort unless writing them makes you feel good.  Write to the point as the lady will be receiving the info by telephone - no one actually goes to the agency to read them as they cannot read English and the Translators do not print them off or make written translations - they telephone the ladies and read a precis from the screen of what THEY think are the relevant points.  

Willy
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Offline falcon

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RE: Baby steps/getting started.
« Reply #10 on: February 23, 2010, 08:47:08 pm »
Willy The Londoner  

Just a word for those who write long long EMF's. Do not waste your time and effort unless writing them makes you feel good. Write to the point as the lady will be receiving the info by telephone - no one actually goes to the agency to read them as they cannot read English and the Translators do not print them off or make written translations - they telephone the ladies and read a precis from the screen of what THEY think are the relevant points.
====================================================================
i had no idea of this is how it happened, thanks for the information. So how does the lady get her message to the translator, by phone as well or on her computer?

Offline Dan

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RE: Baby steps/getting started.
« Reply #11 on: February 23, 2010, 08:57:18 pm »
Willy, interesting point, and good to know, as I have finaly after a few months of sitting on the fence taken the plunge and started writing one of the ladies myself. Great thread!

Offline falcon

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RE: Baby steps/getting started.
« Reply #12 on: February 23, 2010, 09:25:07 pm »
so if it is done by phone, in most cases the lady is very much, or very much could be, at arms length. i imagined the lady getting a written translation and responding with a message that in turn would be translated. it makes so much sense in my case as i have stated before i get basically the same letter over and over, nothing much personal but to be sure sparks are flying. all that said my enthusiasm has not been diminished, my curiosity even greater.

Thanks everyone for the information

Offline falcon

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RE: Baby steps/getting started.
« Reply #13 on: February 23, 2010, 10:33:52 pm »
Sounds like good advice Vince, thanks. Looks can be very distracting.  What"s someone to do though. Mike O seemed to be in a similar situation as mine, persevered and is living happily ever after.

Scottish_Rob

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RE: Baby steps/getting started.
« Reply #14 on: February 23, 2010, 10:38:26 pm »
Roy

No problem at all brother...I knew you were not coming across like that mate.

I was just trying to explain why I had said it to you like that, that was all..

All is good:icon_cheesygrin: