Having some doubts...about site and lady

[RobertBfrom aust]

Lain , good luck on your trip , make sure you have a Besta or similar electronic translator with you as these are invaluable , your head will be on a swivel with all the beautiful ladies , also check out Asian friend finder site or if you are already on QQ type in your heading that you only speak English and you should have about 4 or 5 ladies wanting to speak to you on any given day , regards Robert

[mustfocus]

Lain,

Apology accepted.  One thing you have to consider, a lot of business people (regardless of background) will look for shortcuts or ways to profit from you no matter what the cost.  Not the majority of them, but some of them... and some of them think big.  That's one of the reasons why this forum was created.

As I said previously, try some of the other sites where you can make contact like Blossoms or CLL.  For a fraction of the cost, it will at least get you started before you go to China.  If you have any contacts in China, see if you can nudge them a bit.  Either way, you'll (most likely) be removing the translator barrier... just be careful because many of the agencies post their ladies on multiple sites.  The only difference is that if you use one of the two sites above, they don't profit from it...

Good luck

[Lain]

David, the story you detailed above is pretty much the story line I am getting. For me its not about the money per-say, as I would gladly pay what I have been charged for the service....HOWEVER I have a major mental hangup with being ripped off and outright theft ranks as one of the few things that can move me to become downright violent. :icon_frown:

I will be informing all the people involved this week as to my trip and we will simply see where the chips fall. And just to publicly say out-loud what some might be thinking..YES chnlove DOES monitor this site since this site appears to be the ONLY forum where you can speak your mind and get assistance with issues such as the ones I have posted here. I made several attempts to post on their support forums but EVERY SINGLE POST I made was blocked and I was never even informed as to why, or for that matter given a private reply by the moderators. This should have been an early indicator that things were not as they appear over there.

I do have a Besta MT-7000 that I got about a month ago and I must say that this device is awesome! Sadly, despite spending some time with it my Mandarin is wholly inadequate for any communication. I have translated many of my needs to small cards (blank business cards) that have dual translated instructions for most of the things I may need, or places that I wish to visit. For instance I have a few places I wish to sight see and all I will need to do is hand the card to a cab driver...simple enough. I am simply unable to tech myself this language...oddly enough due to the fact that I taught myself 5 computer programming codes in only 3 years! I will be visiting the IMandarin School in Tianhe, Guangzhou at the Metro Plaza to evaluate them for a year long course with a one-to-one tutor. I will also be looking into a smaller school in Zhongshan too. I like the idea of Zhongshan since its a smaller city.

mustfocus....Absolutely no need for any apologies. I have one of those personality types that people either admire, or hate. I say whats on my mind and tell tell like I see it...and highly respect those who do the same. As a highly analytical person...some would say emotionless to a degree, I much prefer to know the facts without all the window dressing. I can handle critique.....your comments were taken as a welcome perspective and again, no need to apologize for helping me to see both sides of the coin. :icon_cool:

I will update my post here with the details when they happen, and if anyone is wondering...YES, I am very much looking forward to this trip and even if I NEVER even speak too, or meet a lady while I am there the trip itself will be the adventure of a lifetime. I have never left the western hemisphere and I cant wait to see China. Meeting a lovely lady would simply be icing on the cake, and if all goes well I may actually prefer to spend the latter half of my life living in China. American culture has me burned out with its extravagant waste and selfish destructive popular culture.

[ttwjr32]

Lain,

you will find that living here in Guangzhou is really wonderful and would enjoy it living here.
Zhongshan is very small but a nice place also. Guangzhou has everything here unlike some
cities in China. everything from all over the world and the weather is good all year

[brett]

Hi Lain,

I've read some of your thread - my epic Hubei thread shows how this can go horribly wrong, although I had lady troubles rather than chnlove/agency troubles.

Anyway, some observations...

I have been repeatedly told by people whose opinions I value to not trust the Chinese. I know the brothers don't like me saying this, but you know, it is what is is. Take care.

Be especially wary if you're thinking of doing business with the Chinese. Witness some of the stuff we've put up with as far as agencies go, and that's in a line of business that in the West is usually pretty honest. Hell, my ex-lady's agency contract cost more than a UK based one charges.

I think my lady was actually fairly honest, however by not being straight with me over her feelings I had to endure a few months of hell. Whether this was a face thing or just a woman thing I'm not sure. I sure as hell picked up on the fact that she didn't really love me, but it's a shame she didn't have the guts to admit it to me instead of us wasting each other's time. I should have dumped her as soon as I returned from visiting her, but I was stumped due to lack of finding a rebound lady and the fact that I really thought we were a great match :s.

chnlove is expensive - I think I would sign up for a flat rate site in future. I know full well that sites that allow ladies to sign up for free are potential minefields, so take care!

Ladies who don't want to ditch QQ or webcam should probably be ditched, come on there are 9500 ladies on chnlove, so find an honest one.

I'm unsure about living in China, the place is very polluted (do you really know what's in your food?) and the corruption worries me. Around Hong Kong is better than places like Hubei where the pollution was just horrible (and that was in the countryside!). If the China bubble bursts it won't be a great place to be.

If you want to set up an agency, well I have been telling everyone there is a HUGE gap in the market for a Chinese INTRODUCTION AGENCY, like they have in Thailand. A Thai agency will cost $3000 but for that they guarantee to find you a wife plus help with visas and that sort of thing. They also screen the ladies and a good agency will reject 80% of ladies. Guess how many of those clearly unsuitable ladies would end up on chnlove or blossoms?

Running an agency isn't that profitable IMHO, a lot of the smaller ones are done as a hobby.

PM me if you want to set up any online ventures in this (or any other niche), I have been testing the waters and I am pleased with how well this stuff monetises :icon_cheesygrin:.

[Martin]

WOW...Brett, I usually don't comment on your posts.  But this time, there are so many things with this post that I find wrong, I can not help but comment.

You know, where I live are a lot of Native Americans.  They also have a reputation.  Some would say they are all lazy, and all a bunch of drunken Indians.  But then again, my best friend since High School is an Ojibwa Indian.  He works hard at a lumber mill, has worked his way from the bottom up to management.  He likes to have a few beer on the weekends, but nothing too major.  He has two beautiful daughters, who also work hard in school.  His house is big, he owns a couple of cars.  So would it be fair for me to say all Indians are a bunch of lazy drunks?  Yet, on this thread, you say that the Chinese are not to be trusted.  A blanket statement.  Maybe its the British who can not be trusted.  After all, how many wars did they start throughout history?  For that matter, the German's are pretty terrible for what happened back in the 30's-40's.  They can't be trusted either.  The Aussi's can't be trusted, for what they all did to the indigenous people there.  The American's are also pretty terrible people...every last one of them.  You absolutely can't trust an American.  I know this for a fact, because I saw one on the news getting arrested for something or other.  Shall I continue with the stupid comments?

This leads me to another point in your post..."A Thai agency will cost $3000 but for that they guarantee to find you a wife plus help with visas and that sort of thing."  So you are purchasing a wife?  I am wondering how any agency can guarantee that you will find a wife?  The only way I can see this happening, is if you are just purchasing one.  Beyond that, the only two things in life that I was guaranteed, has been death and taxes.

Yes, China is very polluted.  "do you really know what's in your food?"  I don't even know what's in the food I buy here in Canada!  This holier than though attitude against the Chinese people is very racist.  Maybe you do not see it, but I certainly do.

[Philip]

Well said Martin. Couldn't have put it better myself. I hope your wise words give food for thought for everyone on this site and drum home the message that you are not just talking about Chinese women, but about everyone. I doubt whether Brett will learn this lesson, but hopefully the rest of us will stop and think before taking cheap shots at an entire country or race.
Personally speaking, I don't care which continent the moderators come from. It's about character and integrity, not geography. And if they happen to posess Martin's tolerance of difference and his self-awareness, all the better. We all have our prejudices - the problems often come when we fail to acknowledge them in ourselves.
When I got married in Changsha last month, the only other couple in the office was an Indian man and his Chinese bride. Boy, will they have beautiful children.

[mustfocus]

Brett, dude, I don't understand you.

You come here, bash chinese people (which is offensive BTW), say you don't trust them, yet you keep returning to a forum where people are looking for chinese women (never mind that some of us are of chinese descent). :dodgy: But let's move on...

You admonish your ex (here) for not ending the relationship, letting it drag on, but you held onto her because you couldn't find a rebound lady?  So women are disposable items now? :huh: Like WTF?

You're unsure about living in China because of the pollution... I've got a simple solution for you... DON'T LIVE THERE!  While some of the married people here live in China, you don't have to...  I'm sure a lot of people refuse to live in the UK because of the perceived image that the climate there can increase their chances of getting rheumatism...

You're worried about the food you consume there... what makes you think any of the food you consume anywhere is any safer?  Those cockles you had a few days ago (play along here folks, I'm making a point)... they most likely came off a beach somewhere in the UK where people have died before (harvesting them) and the water probably isn't the best either... The oranges you got from the market most likely came from Florida... Where they use chemicals to keep the pests away and to increase yield...  but let's continue...

Corruption... Are you saying that where you live, there are no corrupt people either?  Just in your back yard, let's see... wasn't it the UK parliament who got into trouble for expensing things they shouldn't have (last year)?  Nope... no corruption there...

If you're in Thailand, you might as well go with the vietmanese as well... for $10k, you'll get a docile one as well (refer to another thread somewhere here for the original news article).  A high rejection rate doesn't mean much.

The point is Brett, from the majority of the messages you have posted here, you have a bad sense of self-entitlement.  Let's forget your relationship with your ex... what happens if you marry a japanese or thai lady...then find out she is also a spender?  Are you going to blame her for your woes as well?  I'm sorry this seems harsh, but any time you've received advice, you refuse to follow it, and when the red flags show up, you place blame on others rather than think rationally.

(To the rest of you, sorry if this sounded offensive, but I've gotten quite tired of Brett playing the victim)

[Lain]

Hey guys no need to get personal with this...My opinions were just that, based on working with about 8 different Chinese firms that I had to deal with in a prior job before starting my own business. While a couple were easy to deal with, the others seemed to think that the contract was the starting place to negotiate and it seemed like prices, delivery times and other very important details of my orders were always being changed mid-order or worse disputed after receiving the payment.....it was an excessive hassle and one reason why I simply stopped using Chinese sources. But again, it was BUSINESS and as a business person I can tell ya that I have had many similar experiences right here in the US. Some people in business seem to think that the art of conducting good business revolves around the idea that every deal should be short profit maximized and be dammed the idea of building a long term business relationship.

Personally, I do not consider myself a racist. However that said I was held at gunpoint and robbed while on a vacation in New Mexico, had my $4500 custom mountain bike stolen (got it back) and was almost the victim of a carjacking while in Chicago and these crimes were all committed by blacks. Now whenever I travel I cannot help but be suspicious...and while I have black friends I can honestly say that the "trust" level is lower. Sorry but life's experiences do have an impact on ones views and how we interact with other races. I have also seen my fair share of Chinese sites (forums) where there is somebody making the same generalizations about westerners....Sadly, I tend to agree with many of them. Fat, lazy, ignorant, selfish.....It sort of comes with the American culture. While I admit to being about 10 pounds overweight I am simply AMAZED at how obese average Americans are.:icon_exclaim:

When I told my best friends wife that I was considering a Chinese wife and maybe even moving there, her reaction was one that I did not expect. She is Korean...enough said. :s

But we do not need to argue of these things or sling insults at each other. I appreciate the support I have found here and I hope that my PERSONAL PRIOR EXPERIENCES will be refuted by real contact, with everyday folks there. Will I be cautious, Of course that is just part of traveling and being safe. But I will not allow myself to become cynical due to a few bad actors. I still believe that there are more good, honest and decent people in society than bad people and if I was wrong....places like this site would not exist.

[mustfocus]

Hi Lain,

In the case of Brett's message, it's not you.  If you go back through the forums reading Brett's messages, you'll see why some of us have problems with Brett.

As for chinese businesses screwing around with things after the contract has been signed and people paid... you'll find similar businesses everywhere.  All you can do about that is let others know about those companies... post a complaint to your local chamber of commerce (and their local chamber), trade association and EDC.  As their names get spread around, they will eventually learn.

[David5o]

Lain,

In normal circumstance i would wholeheartedly agree with you but, ....You need to read Brett's threads to understand where there coming from, and why those above have posted these comments.
Sadly, he has never once listened to anyone's good advice on the Forum, he just simply bumbles on, and then blames anyone or anything at hand why this or that didn't work out!!!

The people who's opinions he values, .... were people he had met ONCE, like the owner of the Japanese dating agency!!! Now he wouldn't have a prejudice against Chinese ladies, .....now Would he???   haha!
Another was just a guy he met on a plane!!!!.......

As i said, read his theads and the posts within and you'll get the picture...

David....

[rockycoon]

Well, nothing to comment on this thread.  You have to take the good with the bad...
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." So you are purchasing a wife? I am wondering how any agency can guarantee that you will find a wife? The only way I can see this happening, is if you are just purchasing one. Beyond that, the only two things in life that I was guaranteed, has been death and taxes.
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Ok guys and Martin, where do I purchase one of these wife's, I see the price is 3,000 to 10,000, and they are docile....Hummm,
Do I get a recipt in case it fails to work and can I return for a refund?....:icon_cheesygrin::icon_cheesygrin::icon_cheesygrin:
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I was in Viet-Nam, and I can tell you that a lot of the ladies are very nice, good looking, and faithful. There is nothing wrong with
a Viet-Nam lady except most of them could use a good dentist, as they have not got enough money to get one and for that I am
sincerly sorry.  For the most part, they were hard working people (except those with black pajammas and carrying a AK-47).  They
were all farmers and the girls did anything they could to support the family and the familys were tight knit.  It has probably changed
by now, but for the most part, it's still the same.


That's my two cents worth...

[mustfocus]

Hi Rocky,

It wasn't a putdown of vietnamese women.  A few months back, someone had posted an article about chinese men going to Vietnam to purchase a wife (sound familiar) for $10k... the excuse the chinese men gave was that the vietnamese wives were more docile/obedient than chinese women...  My point was that if you're into purchasing an asian wife...based on what I have seen Brett post, he might as well follow that article.  But then who's he going to blame when that goes south?

Found the post... http://www.chnlove.info/showthread.php?tid=1943

[David5o]

Rocky,

No, .... it hasn't changed to any noticeable degree, except for the teeth that is!! ...haha!!!  You know, that many of the problems of the brown to yellowish stains on their teeth were caused by them being given the then new Tetracycline antibiotic before the age of 7 or so. It permanently stains the enamel of growing teeth and in many cases severely weakened it.  Coupled with there love of sweet things (like sugar cane) and it was a real big problem...lol!!!  

But your right, they are you describe, and just as family originated as the Chinese ladies. In fact that is basically the norm for all of South East Asian ladies...

David....

[shaun]

You absolutely can't trust an American.  I know this for a fact, because I saw one on the news getting arrested for something or other.  Shall I continue with the stupid comments?

YEAH, and everyone know about truck drivers.   They all drive down the road at 90 mph daring you to get in their way while the read porno mags and take NoDoz to stay awake.  :icon_cheesygrin:


Sorry Martin, I just had to say it.  It was laying there begging me to pick it up.