THE RED ENVELOPE

[JamesM.Roberts]

Thanks Paul I finally found it! Mick W. it is called "The hunt for red October.....shoes" in the -Your Trip to China section.
I find this all to be very good fun and gives everyone a chance to join in the fun of a very special day.
One question I must ask Paul .... the evil presence in the house or village (as the story goes)....is that the Bride?? Is she the evil dragon-like creature?? keeping the house or village living in fear?? If so I think I know where I keep my magical sword. 
All I know for sure is I will be armed with the envelopes and a couple extra pairs of red shoes in my coat.

[auburnkp]

I'm sorry to hear that some of you have to give a "red envelope" just because we come from America, Australia, or any other westernized country. I guess some Chinese people assume that coming from the West means we are rich. I guess it depends on where your wife is from. I can totally understand where Arnold is coming from. Maybe you go back and give nothing to anyone and you get the dirty stare. The next time, they will not expect anything. That is as long as you can tolerate the bad thoughts. I am lucky and in the same boat as David E. My wife is from Chengdu as well and her family do not expect a cent from me. I do take them out to a nice dinner though. I think you can always have your wife explain that it is not the Western way to give money, but instead take everyone out to a nice dinner. That is just my thought.

[JamesM.Roberts]

I'm sorry to hear that some of you have to give a "red envelope" just because we come from America, Australia, or any other westernized country.

Dear Auburn please don't misunderstand -this tradition isn't because we are western grooms-This is a tradition in many parts of China-and it is one that many of Chinese grooms go through- It has nothing to do with where the groom is from.
I wish I could have a traditional Chinese wedding like Rhonald, with all the festivities and fun, but since this is Pings second marriage, all I will see is a simple paper signing and dinner with the family.Ping assures me that this is fine by her,but what I wouldn't give to make it a day that she would always remember.
We have to remember as Western men -This is their Country -their customs - their traditions, and we are there to take away their most prized treasures --their daughters.

[Arnold]

I stand by what Qing said , as this was done among her Family for years . This comes with (especially ) her Parent's most likely giving it back at some point and some way . The Aunt's and Uncle's do NOT . But when leaving back to Home , they will shower you with Gift's ( not Money ) . So it's not all that bad .
Also just found out , Qing's brother's Wife ( which works for an American Co . ) actually wants to bring Qing's Son over to us .. so to save us the Money going there . Again , I do not think it's all because they Money-Hungry .. it's just a Family thing .
Neil , I understand you avoided SH Girl's , but on the other Hand .. they are more westernized and less trouble adopting in your Country . By that I mean , inside still Traditional but used to the Western ways better . One just have to find the " Right " one .

[shaun]

David E.  I have the ability to say no and do quite often.  At first it was not received real well but Peggy has gotten the message.  I was more poking fun at Arnold and the concept.  I am sure it is true because Peggy still comes up with things that I should do and a simple no works.

Most recently her younger brother's wife had a baby boy.  Peggy's mother went to Shenzhen to help several weeks ago.  She has been cooking and cleaning the house.  Just a couple of days ago Peggy went there and she is taking care of the baby.  In about a week Peggy will return home and her mother will stay and help for about 10 more months.

Just before Peggy left for Shenzhen she told me that I needed to give a monetary gift to the baby's parents.  I asked how much and she said, "It is up to you."  Well I have been down that road before.  After asking a few times she tells me that her sister is pushing to give and her husband gave $400.00US.  My response was no, I will not give anything right now.  I may later.  First is getting her here to the US.  The only one complaining is her sister and I could care less about her complaints.

[David E]

To clarify........

The issue here from my point of view is not the giving and recieving of red envelopes at the wedding. Quite the contrary, I was married in June and at our wedding dinner the whole bunch of family and friends gave us red envelopes that just about paid for the whole wedding dinner. I also, with great pleasure was able to give Ming's parents a very generous red envelope, because they dont have much money and I know they would be delighted with both the money and the gesture.

What I wont do, which was why I responded to Arnold's post is to continue the red envelope business every time we go back to China (with the exception maybe of birthdays of family and friends).

I have no problem whatsoever with the tradition of giving red envelopes, it is a charming and relevant Chinese Custom....but once is enough, and Ming supported me in my views on it.

But as I said....we all must make our own decisions in this matter, based on what advice we get form our partner and the prevailing customs within her family.

David

[shaun]

Oooo.....  Let me go back and readdress what I said above.  That was my last comment before going to sleep lasting night.  Arnold, sorry.  What I should have said was that I was poking fun at the concept.  I know what Arnold was serious about what he said.  I also know that things differ from family to family, region to region.  I think what Arnold and Qing have worked out between them is excellent and a great example of how a couple should work together.

I also know as in my case that if you open the wallet every time they ask that they will continue to dig deeper into it.   Then guys have got on this forum and complained about the women wanting to take all of your money and go further to say that it is all a scam.  Many times I imagine that the supposed scam stems from the man flashing cash on his trip to impress the woman and her family.  That only feeds fuel to the idea that Western men who come to China are rich.

When I first joined this forum many of the more experienced guys you say to us newbies at that time that we needed to count the cost before going to China.  That is a comment that should be made all of the time.

As time goes on I am sure there will be many things that we did not anticipate and will bring to this forum.  I've heard an old saying that applies here.  Chew the meat and spit out the bones.

[Arnold]

David and Shaun ,  you made good point's .. as to tell other's too .. that it's NOT necessary " ALL＂the time . But do make a point of asking your Lady and do talk it over well , before you decide to answer with a loud NO . Remember to show Face and not let them see your backside .. which has no Face .

[auburnkp]

I agree with David and thanks for the clarification. I too received red envelopes at my wedding. I do give red envelopes during birthdays and baby parties, but not everytime I go to China and visit the family. As an American, I definitely make much more money and am more well off than my wife's family. However, they do not expect any money from me, just take care of their daughter and niece. I really respect them for it. As with many other people here, my wife tells me who to give red envelopes to and how much. The amount usually are 400 to 800 rmb.