Author Topic: The basics of etiquette in China,  (Read 3934 times)

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Paul Todd

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The basics of etiquette in China,
« on: May 27, 2009, 06:38:29 pm »
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This is intended only as a primer on the very basics of etiquette in China, and it's decidedly slanted to a Western Male's point of view. With a little luck, when you arrive in China this will help you avoid severely embarrassing yourself, but trust me - you'll make many faux pas, and most of the time you'll be completely unaware that you've done so because it is not like the Chinese to point out to you any errors you've made. To do so would cause you to lose face, and the Chinese are very concerned neither to lose face themselves, nor to cause loss of face to others. Chinese Women will be particularly forgiving of your rude Western ways.

Before moving on to specific areas of etiquette, here are some generalizations:

1. There are many different "cultures" in China (55 or 56 depending on what book you read) and many variations on specific areas of etiquette, but if your behaviour on any matter is acceptable to most of the Chinese cultures the others will forgive you if it varies from theirs. The other side of that coin is that you shouldn't expect a Chinese woman who is a farm girl from Hunan to practice the same etiquette as a debutante from Shanghai.

2. Chinese Ladies know you're from a different culture and don't expect you to behave exactly as a Chinese man would. In fact they're frequently fascinated by the differences between you and themselves and want to know more. In order to actually offend most Chinese girls you'll have to commit an error in etiquette that is either grossly ignorant or obviously intentional.

3. Chinese women and Chinese people in general greatly appreciate it when you're obviously attempting to understand and follow their cultural norms, and especially when you clearly respect and even enjoy their way of doing things. Just a little evidence that you are "trying" will go a long, long way.

4. Chinese culture dates back 5,000 years or more, and the Chinese are justifiably proud of that, so don't get involved in little contests over whose cultural practices are "correct". You are a guest in their country so their moors of etiquette are correct by default. If you want to appreciate and enjoy your Chinese Lady's companionship, always try to view her through her cultural norms, not your own. On the other hand, there is nothing wrong at all in pointing out that "in America (or Britain, Australia, etc.) we don't do it that way" if you're clearly doing so to explain or excuse your error, not as criticism of their standards. In fact this will generally be a great conversation starter.

5. China is rapidly changing these days, and something that was universally acceptable just 5 years ago may now be generally frowned upon; for example spitting in public used to be the norm, but is now being discouraged everywhere due to the accompanying health threats that have been recently recognized. However, just as in any other country the new etiquette code on this matter is being picked up far faster in the larger, more economically advanced cities than in rural China.

6. Whatever is stated below will prove to be entirely wrong somewhere in China with some Chinese people.

Now, on to some specifics (in no particular order):

Dress

Chinese men, especially in the larger cities and when they can afford it, tend to dress more formally than we do. When you walk down a city street in China almost every male will be wearing at least dress pants and a good shirt with both collar and cuffs. Blue jeans, baggy shorts and wrinkled cotton shirts are almost exclusively the domain of the Western males. You will be forgiven but not often emulated. But in larger city's this is changing now.

Chinese women also dress to a higher standard, and usually take great care of their appearance. Of course there is a poor class that simply can't afford good clothes, but any Chinese woman with any resources at all will be wearing fashionable clothing and looking her best.

Staring

Get used to being stared at in China. You are different and unusual. There are 1.3 billion Chinese living in China, and only about 100,000 foreigners (according to the People's Daily newspaper in 2005), and likely well over 50% of those foreigners are of Asian descent. So for each obviously foreign person living in China there are 26,000 Chinese (1,300,000,000 Chinese / 50,000 non-Asian foreigners). You are very different.

Seen another way, in many of the rural areas of China they've never seen a white person, and even in the major cities, on any given busy city street, there will be more people visiting from those rural areas than there are white people. So, during much of the time during your stay in China, you'll be within sight of someone who has never seen a white person before. If you're of African heritage, you may have to hide in your own bathroom to avoid being in the presence of someone who has never seen anyone like you before. Like I said, get used to being stared at.

More importantly, especially for those same rural Chinese, staring is not considered rude. Once you realize that they are not being aggressive, just curious, you will get more comfortable with endlessly being looked at. For confirmation that they're not being aggressive, try staring back directly at their eyes. You'll soon notice that it takes them a long time to realize you're looking at them because they are not looking at your eyes, which they would be doing if their intentions were aggressive. Once they see you looking at them they'll quickly look away (wondering why some foreigner is so aggressively staring at them.

Queues

Forget it. There is no way for a Westerner to understand the Chinese reaction to a queue, which seems to be that it represents an opportunity to get ahead of other people by leaping to the head of the queue.

After inevitably standing in line in one or more of a thousand places (One tip I heard is the Queue  to get your vegetables weighed and priced at the food market where even the tiniest Chinese female will be particularly adept at bypassing everyone in front of her as if they don't exist) and watching every Chinese person who comes along jump in front of you, you'll eventually become a practised queue jumper yourself. And, since you're likely bigger than almost all of your Chinese opponents in this contest, you'll have a decided advantage. Of course, you'll also be seen as an ugly and aggressive foreigner, but this is the one instance when you are to be forgiven for that (at least by this Writer, if not by the Chinese).

Public Displays of Affection (Male with Female)

Traditionally the Chinese have been very loathe to accept men and women demonstrating love or affection in public through kissing, hugging or holding hands. Lately, especially among younger people, you will occasionally see the holding of hands or light and very brief kisses. Anything beyond that will still lead to the conclusion by the viewing public that the woman is a prostitute and the man is a drunken lowlife (especially if the man is a foreigner).

Public Displays of Affection (Male with Male)

Unfortunately, from a Western male's point of view at least, public display of affection between two men is entirely acceptable in China. In nightclubs it's common for 2 or more men to dance together, on the street they hold hands, and none of that is an indication in anyway of anything beyond mere friendship. For us homophobic westerners it's an uncomfortable experience, but for the Chinese it is perfectly normal and acceptable.

Public Displays of Affection (Female with Female)

The good news, from a Western male's point of view at least, is that public displays of affection between women is not merely acceptable but is commonplace in China. Chinese women are constantly walking arm in arm, holding hands, walking while tightly hugging, dancing together as if they are Latin lovers, falling asleep in each other's arms, and even kissing each other. Give them a couple of drinks and suddenly they might even feel a need to touch each other's breasts (purely out of curiosity, not lust). While the Chinese girls engaging in this activity are being completely innocent (or are they?), to the Western male it's an ongoing trigger of one of our most enduring fantasies.

Basic Greetings

In formal or semi-formal settings, such as business meetings, Chinese when meeting you for the first time will likely greet you with a slight bow or nod, but handshakes are becoming more acceptable and common, and in most cases, after returning the nod a follow up handshake is likely also in order. However, traditionally, touching someone you are not familiar with is not acceptable, so you may want to avoid pushing the handshake with an elderly or less urban or cosmopolitan Chinese person. Don't touch anyone's head!!!!

Generally, unless there is an obvious power structure in a particular group it is appropriate to greet the elder person first, working your way down the age ladder.

Hopes this helps :D

Offline Irishman

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RE: The basics of etiquette in China,
« Reply #1 on: May 27, 2009, 07:45:15 pm »
Haha, I love the queue jumping bit its so true and sooo frustrating at the same time!!
Getting stuff weighed in the supermarket (even fruit already in bags or nets seems to need a weight sticker on it!) is a nightmare and queuing western style is for suckers which is incredibly hard to get used to!

The public affection thing is weird too..its more common to see guys with arms over the shoulder of their male friends than their female ones.

The first week there takes a heck of a lot of getting used to :)
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Offline maxx

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RE: The basics of etiquette in China,
« Reply #2 on: May 27, 2009, 08:40:10 pm »
Irish yes the Queue freaked me out the first time.I grabed a Chinese kid by the back of the shirt and moved him out of the way.When he tried to get infront of my wife.I stuck my elbow in a guys ribs three times till he grunted for trying to get passed me.

The really funny one is the train Station in Guanzghou.They have just announced the train the first time and people are running over each other crashing into walls.falling up the steps dropping there luggage screaming at each other.And my wife is right in the middle of it running along with theese people.I'm strolling threw there like i'm out for a walk in the park.All this time my wife is hollering at me to hurry up.

I will look at her and ask.Why is the train leaving? She will get this big smile.And say no.But we need to hurry up.I just keep walking slowly.Drives her nuts.

Paul where do you come up with this stuff? This one is right on the money.

The men public affection really freaks me out.I seen a Vietnamese guy try to hold the hand of a Iraq guy in pattaya Thailand one time really freaked me out to say nothing of what it did to the Iraqie guy.And I've seen it a number of times in China.

Offline Ed W

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RE: The basics of etiquette in China,
« Reply #3 on: May 27, 2009, 08:49:30 pm »
ya, this is right on. Amazing how hard it is to comprehend reading it and then seeing it and realizing it's sooooo true.
Alright earthlings, what form do you want me to take?....How about a taco, ....that craps icecream?  My trip to china

Offline Irishman

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RE: The basics of etiquette in China,
« Reply #4 on: May 27, 2009, 09:06:51 pm »
Quote from: 'maxx' pid='4065' dateline='1243471210'

The really funny one is the train Station in Guanzghou.They have just announced the train the first time and people are running over each other crashing into walls.falling up the steps dropping there luggage screaming at each other.And my wife is right in the middle of it running along with theese people.I'm strolling threw there like i'm out for a walk in the park.All this time my wife is hollering at me to hurry up.

I will look at her and ask.Why is the train leaving? She will get this big smile.And say no.But we need to hurry up.I just keep walking slowly.Drives her nuts.


Last time I was in GZ train station Ling and i were going to Hong Kong..we had five minutes to the train and she decides she need a trip to the wash room..i'm like..we will miss the goddamn train!!
She goes anyhow and we miss the goddamn by seconds.
I'm pissed and feeling angry..she talks to the station guard or official or person in a suit and it seems we can catch the next train due in another five minutes or so ...
We got that and there was no problem.
She goes to HK on a regular basis so probably knew this all along, but if i had been doing the western tourist thing i'm certain the guard would not have let us passed to the platform with our expired tickets.
The tickets were for the fancy bullet train so maybe they are more lax with those
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Martin

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RE: The basics of etiquette in China,
« Reply #5 on: May 27, 2009, 09:52:37 pm »
Quote
The really funny one is the train Station in Guanzghou.They have just announced the train the first time and people are running over each other crashing into walls.falling up the steps dropping there luggage screaming at each other.And my wife is right in the middle of it running along with theese people.I'm strolling threw there like i'm out for a walk in the park.All this time my wife is hollering at me to hurry up.

Oh good God, we all have train stories.  Maxx, your story is exactly as mine.  I was trying to figure out why everyone was in such a panic to get on board...I asked Zhifang the same thing...is the train going to leave without us?  She said no.  So I asked why everyone was panicking.  She could not answer.  But I did the same thing as you.  Just took my time...I think I was the last to enter the car.

Same goes for getting off the train.  She would want to jump up with everyone else.  I explained that if we waited until most people were out of the way, we could gather our luggage, and comfortable get off the train, without the pushing and shoving.  Surprisingly, she listened to me.  Probably thinking...what a stupid lao gong lao wai.

Paul...keep up the great work finding this stuff!

Arnold

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RE: The basics of etiquette in China,
« Reply #6 on: May 28, 2009, 12:56:42 am »
Thanks Paul , that is some good read .
My Train story is ... there is no Train story . Traveling first Class , you have you seat number and row , economy class .. must be first come first serve . Otherwise , why would they run for it ? Exercise ? It could be all the luggage they carry with them and want a place overhead to put it . Maybe the Tea is getting cold ?

Offline maxx

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RE: The basics of etiquette in China,
« Reply #7 on: May 28, 2009, 01:14:15 am »
Arnold no the train I'm talking about is the overnight train From Guanzghou to JiuJiang.Or from JiuJiang to Beijing.And it is first class.You get your asigned car and asigned bed.In second class you get a chair that looks like the one in your pictures.and they are asigned .Econemy class is they put you in a car with a bunch of other people and you eather get to stand all night our if your lucky the car isn't that full and you get to sit down.

I have no idea why they are running that was the point of the story.

when you buy first class you pick where you want to put your luggage.If there is luggage where you want to put yours.You tell the people to move it.
« Last Edit: May 28, 2009, 02:17:58 am by maxx »

Scottish_Rob

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RE: The basics of etiquette in China,
« Reply #8 on: May 29, 2009, 05:53:47 pm »
I cannot wait to start the amazing adventure you guys are describing.....:):):)

Offline Irishman

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RE: The basics of etiquette in China,
« Reply #9 on: May 29, 2009, 07:56:18 pm »
I suppose the running stuff comes from the metro, in GZ that thing would take you head off if you didn't make it in the carriage in time. Rush hour metro was something i never want to experience again - i'll pay for the taxi
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Vince G

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RE: The basics of etiquette in China,
« Reply #10 on: May 30, 2009, 12:00:42 am »
Sounds like the NY Subway. Some are good enough to wait for others to get off the train while somme cram themselves in at the same time.

Arnold

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RE: The basics of etiquette in China,
« Reply #11 on: May 30, 2009, 12:14:58 am »
Irish , I guess you can say , it's like before and after a Soccer match of great importance . Stempede in and Stempede out . That is without any fight's , in that case multiply by 10 .

ttwjr32

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Re: The basics of etiquette in China,
« Reply #12 on: June 28, 2010, 10:22:26 pm »
with quite a few people planning on making the journey here to china i thought it would be good to
bring back pauls post on etiquite for those who might not know or have read it its a good post with
some great points for you to know when you arrive here to help you understand

Offline David S

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Re: RE: The basics of etiquette in China,
« Reply #13 on: June 29, 2010, 01:24:10 pm »
Same goes for getting off the train.  She would want to jump up with everyone else.  I explained that if we waited until most people were out of the way, we could gather our luggage, and comfortable get off the train, without the pushing and shoving.  Surprisingly, she listened to me.  Probably thinking...what a stupid lao gong lao wai.

I've seen westerners do the exact same thing on airplanes even before the door is open and the bell rings.  I just sit and wait for things to clear out a bit and pick up my luggage and walk out in comfort instead of standing with my head hunched over being obscured by the overhead luggage because I can't get into the isle.

ttwjr32

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Re: The basics of etiquette in China,
« Reply #14 on: June 29, 2010, 06:25:33 pm »
that also totally amazes me. the plane is taxiing to the gate and everyone jumps up and gets the overhead baggage
down and then just stand there for a while. they are crammed in the isle with most having to bow as they are to tall
and i see some of them getting upset as they get annoyed at the wait time. i just sit in my seat and relax and wait.

one flight the person next to us asked if we were going to get up and i said NO why do i need to get up and stand in
front of my seat as there is no place to go. were are you going to go the isle is already filled with impatient people who
think they are getting off the plane faster than if they just sat and waited. well he preceded to complain and i told him if
he wants to stand then stand but we are not going to move out of here until the isle clears but if he really wants to push his
way out into the isle then i will stand to let him pass although i see it as a mute effort at this point.

afterwards a day later i saw the same man at the trade show we were attending and he was a vice president of a pretty
large company in the states. must have been in quite a hurry to get to his hotel room at the mgm grand in vegas