Just when........

[David E]

Just when life has setled into a state of normality and stability, after nearly 3 years of marriage....a real bastard curved ball came out of the blue and has got me reeling...

Some 4 days ago, Ming was reading me a snippet from some Chinese news App. she has constantly running on her I-Phone..

It regarded a story about a couple who were walking along a a rocky beach and the woman slipped and fell into some pretty bad water. The Man (very sensible in my opinion) was not inclined to jump in and try to save her because he was not a particularly strong swimmer and realised it would be near certain suicide if he jumped in, resulting in the outcome that BOTH of them would die, and nobody would be left alive to care for their kids/family.

So he legged it off down the beach calling for help, and fortunately got some assistance to get her out before she was drowned. She was pretty beat up by the surf and the rocks and spent weeks in hospital recovering.

Ming asked me what I would do if she fell into the water in a similar scenario. I reponded as we have been advised to do over many years of "water awareness" in Aus, that I would do the same and go for help. I explained that my suicide and her death would achieve nothing and better that one of us survived, and at least increased the chances of her surviving if I could find professional help quickly enough.

This apparently was the wrong answer...so I got a real vitriolic blast about how selfish I was, how uncaring about her, and how I was always thinking of myself as No 1, just like all Men...!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I got real pi...ed off with this response, considering all that I had done for her in the past 4 years to bust my ass to ensure she had a good life here with me...I wont list all these things because I dont want to get into a "points scoring" contest with her...it achieves nothing...but you get the drift.

Since that time, even with the Maxx 24 hour rule in play, life has been hell. She tells me the marriage is broken and is talking about divorce and returning to China. I thought a day or so of the "miffs" would get this rubbish out of her system and life would return to normal...but it is getting worse...she is out all day now with her Chinese friends, does not cook or anything, does not speak or want to discuss it....

I've got about 24 hours left on MY fuse before it finally hits the gunpowder and I will blow this whole thing to smithereens...such a trivial issue should never trigger such an irrational response...I gues there is something else going on here that I dont know about...but I'm buggered if I know what and she wont talk about it......

Watch this space...things will get very heated around here very shortly.

So sad

[Arnold]

David, I consider you a much smarter Man than myself here.. but you "Should" have known better "Not" to give an answer like that. It doesn't matter if you think otherwise, you definitely jump in after her (when she asked you).. doesn't mean "If" it would happen you have to then.
This was one "Hidden" or "Sneaky" test that she took adventage off and you got tails instead of heads. I think we should all install the 24 hour rule into our Ladies/Wife as soon as the first date. It is a two-way street agfter all ( at least in the western world it is) but you know the Traffic in China....

Wish for a good outcome for you David!

[David E]

Yes Arnold...I was fully aware that the answer she was looking for was that I would jump in and try to save her...whatever the cost.

In fact, if we were in the early stages of a courtship or even a marriage I would have told the "lie" and responded accordingly.

But heavens above, we have known each other for nearly 5 years now, and she has lived here in Aus with me for nearly 3 years. Surely there comes a time where trust and honesty should override such "cosmetic" and false responses between a married couple. And yes, I also understand that "I can take Ming out of China, but I cant take China out of Ming".
Especially considering that my ACTIONS towards her have always conclusively proved that she is of extreme importance in my life....I have done EVERTHING I have ever said I would do, and been a reliable, honest and caring husband.

I dont play around, I have always considered her culture and feelings in how I have re-structured my life to doubly ensure she is happy....my conscience is squeaky clean.

I can even accept and not get concerned over a short term spat from her over my response...but I cant/wont allow such trivial bullsh**t to continue to present such a corrosive and uncomfortable state of affairs to exist as it does right now.

After all, I too have a cultural background that is just as important and different from hers...and that includes a natural aversion to getting into the habit of telling lies just to keep the peace...it's a two way street.

What has irked me most, is that such a ridiculous state of affairs has come to pass from a "no-consequence" , theoretical arguement over a theoretical no-consequence set of circumstances that in reality have no relevance. Besides which, in the cold light of reality, I guess I am not quite prepared to commit suicide on her behalf...or anybody's !!!!!...nor am I prepared to lie about it to preserve some obscure set of Chinese cultural norms that I neither know or care about in this SPECIFIC issue of jumping into a death trap so that we can both die

[Rhonald]

Wow, I agree - the rational just seems to take second place at times. Seems like theoretical discussion has to be off limits, which I can understand is something you usually get enjoyment from discussing. In my relationship, it is sometimes a challenge when my wife gets new, big ideas for starting different businesses. Theoritical discussions don't seem to be a sticking point as it appears to be for you.

Seems like stable has its other meaning as in a home for a wild horse.

[Arnold]

.... from a "no-consequence" , theoretical argument over a theoretical no-consequence .... , so what is a theoretically lie to save ones ass or marriage in your case. I totally agree with your thinking for not having Japanese blood in you and saying goodbye to this world to keep another Person happy in her ill fated moment.

Just the other night Qing and I watched "The Abbys" (I have seen it before not so Qing) and when their Craft was about to flood with only "ONE" diving-suit, the Woman chose to drown herself to be pulled by the Guy to the Main Station and then try to revive her there. Anyway, I told Qing that I would definitely give her the suit... without any hesitation she corrected me... that she must give it to me. I can see, this could lead to a Fight that most likely cost both our Life's before it's settled. There is something instilled in these Women, that is even harder to figure out then our "Normal" western Girl's for sure.

[David E]

Yep...watched "The Abyss"...but that was a completely different scenario...

Giving the only suit to the man was the best way to increase the probability that BOTH would survive...the man ( being stronger) could more quickly tow the drowned woman back to the rig...and under conditions of hypothermia, she would have a very good chance of revival. To give her the suit would be likely to result in BOTH of their deaths....she would struggle to get back to the rig before he suffered irreversible brain damage.

To jump into a raging Ocean to rescue a woman...without any life support, or specialist training is the highest probability for both to die. To go for professional help is the best chance for both to live.

I am sure that the problem I face is not one of odds or probabilities...it is one of "face"...I bet she has discussed this scenario with some of her scaly Chinese mates who were totally convinced that their husbands would NOT jump in......just see it as an opportunity to get a younger wife..... ...whereas Ming and bragged that HER LG would immediately leap in and save her...my response put the mockers on her statements and she loses face.......not my problem !!!!...I am the innocent victim here....and not happy about it.

[Rhonald]

The worse thing is that you are being honest and yet, you get dammed for it. You seem to hit the nail on the head thinking the situation is due to face.

[shaun]

David I recently went through an ordeal with Peggy that brought us to critical mass.  It was either going to kill the relationship or make it better.  Peggy spoke of divorce.  She consulted with her friends.  She lost a lot of face.  We fought about it a lot.   Finally I just got quiet and gave her space.  On my own, and I know this isn't your cup of tea, I spent time praying about it.   I did some private consulting with Maxx over the issue but the biggest thing that happened was giving her time to sort everything out.  Then after about 1 1/2 weeks she began to thaw out a little and we finally got back on track.  Everything is good now.  Remember that these women like to blow off some steam but they are practical.

I don't know if this will help you but if it does great.

Another thought just came to me.   Menopause!!!!!   

[Rhonald]

Another thought just came to me.   Menopause!!!!!   

Yes the time that us Men need to pause before commenting!

[Arnold]

The worse thing is that you are being honest and yet, you get dammed for it. You seem to hit the nail on the head thinking the situation is due to face.

Well yes, but did Ming have time to even talk to anybody regarding this artical? Only then would 'Face" be involved... right? It sounds more a -one on one- question. On the Honest part, I also have been told many times that I'm too honest by many Folks. As the World turns, so do the Morals.. I guess?

[maxx]

David my computer is trying to eat it self right now.I think I know whats wrong with your wife. and I think I can tell you how to fix it.So I will write a proper post after I get this dammed computer straightend out.In a couple of hours.Till I get this computer fixed don't do anything crazy

[Rhonald]

Face would be involved as my wife likes to also think forward about the loss of face in things that have not yet even happened or might never happen. It is hard to say how hidden meanings are interpretted if language is not at a high level as well.

[Willy The Londoner]

 My wife is going through the menopause as we speak.  I can understand what she is going through.  I am also glad that is is happening whilst she is with he family close by (same gardens, different block).  I think that talking with family and friends about it is something that she could not do with me as her English and my Chinese is definately not up to such in depth conversations yet.

Us men will never know the effect that such occurences have on women. They have a distinct knowledge when they come into puberty and they have that same knowledge when the menopause kicks in.  I did not really know when puberty first came to me and so far it has still not left me, well not completely.

My wife has needed a lot more reassurance at this time that I am here for the journey and I will definately not be looking for a younger woman.  She does think at times that she is no longer a 'full woman' For me it was a relief as I never wanted to bring up children at my time of life.

 I do not know how long the 'proceedure' takes but I have detected that slight change in her character and the fact that she tires more that usual.

I just hope for David's sake that this is the reason and that time will prevail. 

Willy

[JohnB]

Rhonald,
"Another thought just came to me.   Menopause!!!!!   
Yes the time that us Men need to pause before commenting!"
That is so damn funny! Amazing.

DavidE, I look at this strictly as a gender issue. No more than that. The question is hypothetical. Your answer should have been YES. It does not matter the situation,
it is just that will you be there for her in times of distress, danger, or whatever threatening event. You are her husband!
Think of it, what are the possibilities the two of you are on a rocky shoreline pounded by waves? If it be so, you had better be holding her tightly!

As you indicated, you have done much for Ming. The thing is, just file your lie in the file with the rest of everything else. Let it meld in time with all the good things.

[Martin]

I can't add any valuable input here, but I am happy you are sharing this with us. It certainly gives me a lot of insight, and a lot more questions. I look forward to reading what Maxx has to say.