Inconsistencies in EMF messages

[brett]

Hi all,

I've got to the half a dozen EMF's stage with a lovely girl I'm interested in and things are looking :heart: lol.

Although her letters are much more personalised than the rather standard replies I've got from other ladies, there seem to be quite a few inconsistencies. Like I mentioned I like travelling a couple of times, then in her latest letter she asks me if I like travelling and to send her some pictures of my travels.

Does anyone else experience similar things, or is it likely to be translation errors etc.?  I guess it could just be the way they word things as well, e.g. "do you like travelling?", even when they know full well that you do.

Anyway, I sent her a picture of one of the Pandas I saw when I went to Hong Kong's Ocean Park, that ought to melt her heart :blush:.

[Neil]

Mike, I got exactly the same type of error on one of my messages.  Our translator ceased to exist too afterwards.  Body's probably floating in a river somewhere.  lol.  Just kidding.

Brett, it can be especially true in a bigger agency where they employ multiple translators.  One may not know what was said in previous letters and could get things a bit confused.  Positivity and trust through misunderstandings will go a long way toward helping any relationship but especially this type.

[Scottish_Rob]

Mike , Neil this has also happened to me about someone else's name being used...
I got an apology from the translator, and the agency bosses, they were very apologetic and Keren was sooo angry and upset about this because it nearly ended us...The 'excuse' I got from them including Keren was, that the translators have about ten girls to cover for, so there are many letters they have to reply too etc

The thing I found funny about the response I got from the agency boss was, he used the WRONG name to me as well hehe  He called me Chip lol

[Arnold]

brett, simple misunderstanding ...... it could be she knows you like traveling ... because you told her in previous letters, but she wants more information .... so instead of staying ...

"I understand you like to travel, tell me more about that, and can you show me some pictures ...."

the translator tells you

"Do you like travelling? please send me some pictures?"

to the translator both are the same thing .... but to you ... the second is frustrating, and makes you fell you were not heard in previous letters... it only gets worse if you reply in a negative way, because of the frustration, and then the Lady thinks she did something wrong by showing interest in you.... and then it upsets her also because of the language and cultural barriers, there can be lots of problems that are artificial, like this example.... you have to assume the lady is being very sincere, and honest, and curious, and is interested in you, and paying attention
Mike:)

Well said and very true David !
ahhh ...  Mike ha-ha  sorry. Hope I don't loose my Job over this error ?:s
Seems to happen to all of us one time or another .

[Vince G]

Brett, Mike is right and you can't take it as a negative. There's a good chance the translator isn't to well versed in the english language translation. Some words don't work well when being translated so you have to give them a little slack. That "do you like travelling?" could have easily have been "SO you like traveling?"

There were times (still) that I would say something and nothing is mentioned in the next letter but in the following letter it would be? I asked a few questions and figured what was going on. My lady would get my letter and send a reply. Later when she got to read the letter she would then give answers or comment on that letter. So it seemed she was always one letter behind. It's not always done for every letter but again you have to give them some slack in giving answers.

[brett]

Thanks guys.

Yes some of the answers I find a bit confusing but I am gradually teasing more information out of her. Her agency is in a different city as well so perhaps there are more communication problems as she can't visit them in person.

Fortunately she seems quite computer literate and has a computer at home and work so we might try some direct communication a bit further down the line :icon_cheesygrin:.

[Londoner]

During my recent visit to China, I was with a girl I visited there. We started talking about the first admiration letter she sent me. It turns out that she actually never sent an admiration letter to me so we thought that we read it together back in the hotel. When I logged on to the Chnlove website, we found a long EFM letter sent in her name asking me why i didn't write to her for so long. We had such a laugh about it.

This just shows the authenticity of many of these EMF letters, which are not worth the time you spend reading them. It would be foolish or naive for anyone to build their hopes and dreams solely on EMF letters alone.

I am glad many of us on this brotherhood have come to this conclusion now:icon_cheesygrin:

[David E]

Guys...your opinion please !

I have exchanged several EMF's with a woman who interests me a lot....the attraction seems to be mutual too....her letters are warm and chatty, filled with lots of information !!!

I am prepared for some inconsistencies in EMF's for all the reasons talked about.....but

Here are 2 sentences from ONE letter...received yesterday...

"We have another nice sunny day here, it's warm."....said early in the letter

"We have a rainy day today, and it's cold. My son will come by and we may go out to have lunch together"...said later in the same letter

Now I dont get at all hung up on whether its hot, cold or medium where she is, but the red flag here for me is....did she actually write this letter Is this yet another Translator scam ??....Translator too busy or incompetant to get on the ball and not make stupid errors.

I really like this woman...or should I say I really like the letters I got from somebody !!!!!........what to do

DavidE

[Buzz]

David E.  
Could be as simple as my lady.  It takes her two days to write a letter, so the weather could have changed from one day to the next.  Or since my lady handwrites her letter, and then faxes it to another city, the weather could have changed.  Over all, I try and not get to hung up on the small details, what I look for is overall consistency.  Even with a recent change in translators, still happy here.

I have to say that she has opened up with the questions and ideas about the future.  Her latest letter dropped a bombshell.  Now mind you we have never professed our love, we have just been slowely getting to know one another.  So she said, what do you think about us living half a year in China and the other half in America.  That way neither one of us will get to homesick.  

Going to have to stop the bus here, we need to wait for these questions after we meet and decide if we are a match made in cyber space.

buzz

[David E]

Thanks Mike

Yes, I know you are right...until I go to meet her, I never can be sure of much !!

Dont forget, before I joined here I went 5 times to China, and got zapped 5 times !! and I am trying to make number 6 count for something :icon_cheesygrin::icon_cheesygrin:

So I will just keep writing and hope to get to QQ stage sooner or later which will at least demonstrate that she actually exists !

Buzz

I get daily letters from her, so it is not the passage of time that drives this anomaly !...I just hope the translator was half asleep, or hungover and got slack !!

Cheers

DavidE

[David]

We have all learned that sometimes the translator injects things into the woman's EMF letter if she thinks it will help the relationship along.  Also as Scottish Rob has already said, the translators have several women that they are doing work for at the same time.  So I understand how a wrong name can be used.   I would only be worried about a wrong name if it was used during a live video chat!  Hehehe.   Anna told me a funny story about when she was forced to use the translator at her previous agency.  Anna is a University level English teacher so she really has no need to use a translater at all.  I would bet she could work as a translator (and be a very good one) at any agency.  She became concerned when she received a reply from a man she was writing to and in his letter he said I love you too!  In her mind this meant that I love you had been placed in her last letter to this man.  She had never written I love you herself so she became angry that the translator had added this to her letter.  She later confirmed this when she called the agency to complain.  The translator had injected the I love you for her own good and to supposedly help move her relationship along.  So I really think it is very important for all the brothers to move to an additional form of communication as soon as possible so you know that you are in direct contact with the lady.  Anna and I use Skype video chat almost everyday and I can't recommend it enough!:heart:

Big Dave

[Danny]

I don't think it is always a matter of dishonesty.

I had an interesting experience with my ex-woman from Zhuhai, when I was having dinner with her and her good friend, the translator. This is the translator who has been translating our emf mails for the past year.

The translator was meant to be there to translate, but she was as much a participant as my ex-woman and me.

For example, my woman would speak to me in Chinese for about five minutes. Then I would get a one or two sentence "translation" summarising what had been said. At other times, there was a short Chinese sentence, then I would get a long "translation". There were other times I would say something and the translator just ignored what I attempted to say to my ex-woman, and then other times they just sat and had a discussion together . . . *laughs*

It didn't seem to bother my ex-woman at all, the way this discussion was taking place, so I didn't mind either.

It was just interesting to see how it took place in real time. It gave me some useful insight into the differences in the way westerners want translators to act and the way they act in practice. It seems to me that Chinese translators see themselves more as "facilitators" than some kind of improved translation "machine" (which is the way I think most of us would prefer them to act, at least most of the time).

I think that even when things are added to the letters to the translators, it is done to help the relationship along. Of course, for most of us, we don't want that kind of help, we would prefer to know things as they really are, however discouraging that might be.

[Vince G]

If something like your example was happening I would be suspicious. A few sentences and all you got were a couple of words? I have talked with people that have interpreted for another. They glide them through it but not telling them what was said.

Here's an example. On one of my old jobs, the boss use to give christmas bonuses out. He was an older man really a nice guy. He liked to tell jokes. Some of the workers didn't speak english so we had translators to help them. So Carlos (the translator) and the worker came out of the office laughing. I asked what happen? Carlos tells me the old man told a joke and what happen. Carlos told the worker, he's going to tell a joke I'll tell you when to laugh. The boss said his joke and Carlos said OK Laugh.

The other part of this is the lady didn't bother to learn english after a year?

[Voiceroveip]

Another thing about translation and why adding certain things might be justified. I speak 3 languages fluently (well my accent in English is going down the hill for lack of practice) and did my share of translations trying to make some money while in University. Sometimes you can't get the tone or the real intent across in the translation, especially when you stick precisely to what is being said in the original language, so adding some bits here and there can make sense. However, I don't think that most of the agency translators are really good enough to get the tone/intent we mean, and I'd be curious to get a reverse translation by another translator back, just for the laugh. The same thing applies the other way around too I think. So when a lady writes to us in a tender romantic tone without using any love words, I think the translator's only choice is to add some love, dear, sweet etc stuff, and of course we don't like that, and the lady never wrote that

[Johnboy]

Hello all, I'm new here although I have been reading various posts and threads for some while and trying to understand the site's procedures and ethos.  Firstly, I have to say that I find the contributions brilliant, fascinating and incredibly enlightening - in fact I feel that I already know many of you from the many things you have written!  I really don't know what I would have done without all the incredibly good advice you have provided for me, despite you even not knowing you were doing so.  But I suppose that's the underlying value and gift of this site.  Secondly, I have been a registered member of Chnlove since late March of this year and, although I don't know if this is the right place to do so, I would be grateful if I could share my experience with you thus far - and hopefully draw on the multitude of experienced advice that is available here.

I don't know how I stumbled on to Chnlove, I was surfing and it popped up in my browser and I found myself looking at thousands of profiles of beautiful Chinese women; and then suddenly I found myself looking at the most beautiful woman I had ever seen in my life (I know that 'beauty is in the eye of the beholder' but this was MY dream of perfection) so I sent her a cupid note and was astonished to immediately receive her reply saying that she was very intersted in me and asking me to tell her my story.  I had never been on a dating website before and as I said earlier, I'm new here; I was also new to Chnlove.  But from much of what I've read here I'm beginning to think I received 'her letter' from a translator, agency individual, whoever.              

For a variety of reasons, which are too long to relate here, I did not actually get round to buying credits and replying until 1st September and, again, to my surprise, she replied within hours.  To cut a long story short: I did as she had previously asked and told her my story, using all my allowed 6000 characters (actually I've discovered that spaces are counted as characters so I usually only get approx 4500 characters not the 6000 stated by Chnlove and I've had a couple of exchanges with Chnlove Customer Services about that and had the expected 'smoke and mirrors' response).  I also asked her a few simple questions to get communication flowing like "Do you have brothers or sisters?", "Do you still live at home with your parents?", "What type of music do you like?"  The reply I received was very short, did not mention anything I had written about (some of which, someone who was "very intersted in you" would certainly have responded to) and was briefly and mainly about hotpots and mountains.  There was also mention of trust, honesty, being straight and direct and simple relationship is perfect.  Oh, and a gleam of hope: "I am sure God bring us here to meet." There were no replies to any of my questions and my initial reaction (before I had even read the posts here) was that she hadn't seen my letter or had it properly translated to her.  So in my next reply I voiced my concerns with her and put in a footnote to the translator to please make sure that my letter was properly and fully translated to Fei and that she received it.

This seemed to have a spell-binding effect as the reply was long, my simple questions were answered, there were profuse apologies and I was assured by my lady that the translator told her every word in my letter. She also asked me to trust her and believe that she did not "cheat" me, which I had not even implied in my letter.  There were also some lovely words: "You have brought so much good cheer and deep love into my life"; "Every letter you send to me makes my heart melt" etc.  I was sooo happy, I was flying! So, I replied in a similar vein that that was how she made me feel too etc - only to receive a reply hours later that began "so long time I no receive your letter" and which was business-like, short and devoid of any affectionate terms.  She also told me for the first time that she can not speak or read English but I'm ok with that because I can not speak or read Chinese.  To be fair, there were some nice pleasantries like asking me to teach her English song one day and she cooking spicy food for me when we get together but it was light years from the previous letter.

Fast forward and coming to this site: I now realize that "deep love into my life" and "make my heart melt" were translator's fluff and I'm very annoyed and feel a bit of a fool.  Fortunately, I have read the 24 hour rule during my clicking around here and thank God I had because I think I may have jumped in and ruined everything.  Sorry if this is so long- winded but there is a point to it all, which I'm about to get to (what was that? Hooray? Damn Cheek!), and at least you will know my story and I won't have to rehearse it in bits and pieces again.

The point is, I desperately need some good advice from you Brothers who have a wealth of experience.  I really like this woman, head over heels in fact, and I do not want to ruin things with a wrong reply.  So far we have exchanged 5 EMF's each.  She has told me that she was immediately attracted to my profile, that God brought us to meet, that we have a bright future together and that she really cherishes this chance ( among many other uplifting and hope-giving words).  She also immediately sent me 'ordinary 'photos' of herself when I gently asked if she would. However, I'm beginning to have some doubts; not about how I feel but about how she really feels, or if many, or even any, of the words and thoughts I cling to are really hers or are translator embellishments and inventions.  There are constant repetitions in all her letters about trust, honesty, simple girl who likes a simple life, simple relationship is perfect etc, and I seem to recall something about that in a thread here that set alarm bells ringing.  Also, I'm the type of person who accepts all of those values as paramount principles for a relationship and then moves on to building the relationship.

But I now have a big problem: after her last but one letter when she (or the translator) wrote all those affectionate words, profuse apolgies and "really cherish this chance", I received an update from Chnlove of my matches (I had forgotten to stop this although I have hidden my profile as a sign of my commitment to Fei) and her refreshed profile was among them!  I've read a lot about this subject in various posts, particularly the invaluable contributions of Vince and Proteus, and the overall conclusion seems to be that the lady virtually has the final say about whether her profile is refreshed or not, indeed, she can request that it is.  In this respect, Chnlove detail this as the lady showing that she is active and available and expecting Admirer Mails.  I am about to write to my lady again and feel that I have to mention what has occurred, albeit gently!  In fact I am tempted to plagiarize Mike's (MPO 474) "One last thing" way of dealing with it without using his "so please forgive me if I have intruded" conclusion, because I couldn't bear the thought of her accepting and my losing her.

Another thing that bothers me is that she has refreshed several times and each time her 'photos have become sexier and more heavily photoshopped, although I think that her 'ordinary', or outside pictures as she calls them, are utterly beautiful - just as when I first saw her profile.  And, although I accepts Vince's used car scenario on this, Chnlove appear to have metamorphosed an utterly beautiful woman into a sex siren.  What do I make of this?

I know it's only early days and we have only exchanged 5 EMF's each.  I haven't asked for any of her contact details or given her any of mine, email etc, and I doubt that it would be much good as neither of us speak each other's language so I can not arrange any direct contact.  Also, I wonder if it isn't too early for that anyway.  But I do know that I really, really like this woman and will do anything to make our relationship work and last, but it has to be a mutual desire.  I don't know anything about Chinese women and their cultural differences; what delights and impresses them and what offends and repulses them, but I'm trying to learn from this site.  Many of you Brothers are extremely experienced in these matters - so please HELP!    

There you have it, and at least you won't have to put up with that again.  Next posts will be succinct and from the hip and not outpourings from the heart.  But please, I would really welcome any help you can give me to resolve this dillemna.  Thank you!!!