China Romance
General Discussion and Useful Links => Ask An Experienced Member => Topic started by: Irishman on December 16, 2009, 11:58:36 am
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Festive title :D , hope you all get my meaning!
Philips "trouble in paradise" post has me more than a little concerned about the financial side of things.
So my question here is , when does the hard talking really start about wedding costs?
I am going to marry my Sunny, the question at this stage is not if, its when.
So, when do i broach the topic of dowry to her parents, wedding costs etc? Should it be after I meet them, should I start talking right now or once we have decided a wedding date?
I don't want to come across as being tight, but frankly i want to buy a house in the next two years as i believe the housing bust will be over around then . This will be a home for the family Sunny and I start together and I want to get the best value and size, location etc possible for us.
A crazy expensive wedding like the money being bandied around (200K RMB) puts that back about two years and as such will reduce the amount I can borrow also as I will 41 by then so closer to retirement.
I know its her big day and everything and realise its not going to be free, but 20K Euro is just not in the ballpark of what I was figuring on spending.
So when and how should I broach this with her?
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Ronan,
Don't even think of having to pay out that sort of money for a wedding in China, it's just not going to happen. In your position, and Sunny being a single young lady, i would be reckoning on around the 2000 Euros mark, and a ceiling of 2500 Euros MAX!! It could be a hell of a lot less too, it just depends on if there is a RE involved, and whether she wants the full works or not!!! Remember, ...this is for one single day in your life together, so you want to spend the least possible, but enough to make it a day you can both remember with pride!!
You can broach her about it anytime you want too, just bring it up in your normal conversations, it's not a taboo subject when all said and done. Just start asking her leading questions on what she is envisaging for her wedding day. Then just start watching the Euros spin, toting up at an ever increasing speed!! ...hahaha!! But seriously, most weddings in China do not cost the earth, and nothing like they would or could cost you in the UK/Europe/USA etc.
David....
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David is sooo right on this Irish . I seen Couple's spend $30,000 on their Wedding .. only to be parting a few year's later . All the Money on Photo's which cost an Arm and Leg nowaday's ... for what ? Qing and I started to talk about our Wedding Celebration well before me ever meeting her Face to Face first . I picked our date month's before going to see her . I know that sounds funny , but we had no doubt whatsoever ... we're going to do this then . Nobody in their right mind can expect that kind of money
( 200K's ) for a Wedding unless your or your Woman is ready to dish it out and have plenty left afterward's . Even in Shanghai where thing's are almost more expensive than here in the US .
This is just another scary thing like the Agency pay-up contract's . Everything can and should be talked over well with either matter and the outcome is usually alway's in your favour without someone flying off the handle .
So , take this number out of your Head and work on a reasonable one TOGETHER .
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Thanks David and Arnold, I think i'll chat to her about it when I am there in February. I'll talk to her about it in a gentle way i think. David, I reckon that is the best approach, talk about how she sees her wedding day and take it from there.
I'm guessing she has little idea as to cost right now, its her first wedding after all, but i know if I ask her about this stuff she will network and find out pretty soon as that how everything is done there! :)
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Ronan,
Sunny will have more than a good idea of how much the different wedding things will be without any networking between friends and family. Her networking will be to find the best prices and from where, if i know the Chinese women. ..haha!!!
It's always better to bring things up in this way, the discreet leading questions normally tend to lead, to what you want to know. I still use this method of finding out things with Lucy now, and she probably does the same with me too ...lol!!! ....It's the Chinese way!!!!
David....
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DONT you bring up the red Envelope. Do not open that pandoras box. Let her bring it up. If she doesnt let it lay. lol
I think you remember what I went through. As I just said in the other thread. I finally set an amount and handed it to her.
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I think it is always a good idea to confess your ignorance about such matters. I would start by saying that if you were to be married in your own country you would know exactly what was a suitable and fitting marriage. But in her country, you are not able to know.
Treat it as problem solving, rather than a negotiation which is conducted on a win-lose basis. If you set up the conversation as a friendly exchange of information, it won't get out of hand. But if you start with maximum costs, without agreeing about what's going on, then you are going to end up upsetting each other.
If she says a certain figure then anything less than this means she loses face (she does not deserve to have a good wedding) and you lose face (you are a poor and miserly man).
I would step away from the problem, and get more information about the matter. Ask, for example, how much weddings of recently married people in her life cost. Tell her about how much weddings cost here.
Often disagreements are nothing more than misunderstandings. There are genuine disagreements. But often when you understand each other properly, the disagreement is already gone.
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I recall reading here about one of the "Society" weddings in Perth between two of our so-called "A" list Italian families...they bragged that the wedding cost nearly AUS$50,000....and it was a vast affair !!!
That roughly translates to 250,000 RMB !!!!!!!!
I find it impossible to believe that even a monster Chinese wedding could cost 200,000 RMB....I bloody hope not !!!!!!
I will pose the question to Ming tonight and report back what her opinions are about the cost of a "reasonable" Chinese wedding.
David
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Danny,
I have got to disagree with you big time on this!! To agree with a sum of money totalling 200000RMB is just ludicrous to save her Face. She can have a more than good wedding for 2000 to 3000 Euros and even a lot less. There are plenty of Married guy's here now, that are not ignorant about such matters.
Yes i do agree with you in one aspect, that this is all a misunderstanding, but none the less the man needs to assert his disagreement when he see something is wrong. This like marriage, is a two way thing, so you don't just bow down and let these ladies dictate what she wants and you follow her wishes blindly.
David.....
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David E, David5o: you forgot the Shanghai and Beijing Princesses.
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RegnisTheGreat,
Even they would have to go some, to spend 200000 RMB on a wedding day!!!
And who the hell would want one of them round your neck, ...whispering sweet i want, i want, i want in your ear 24/7 ... These are best left to the guy's with more money than sense, than to any of us on this Forum...lol!!
David
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RegnisTheGreat,
These are best left to the guy's with more money than sense,
Isn't that more money then cents? :icon_cheesygrin:
I paid about $5,000 Cdn for our wedding. Sent 3,000 before I arrived then another 2,000 there. It was more then I had anticipated but say la visa
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Heck, I don't want a Shanghai Princess. I can't afford one either. My brother can, but he's already married to some gal who works too and earns her money.
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I think it's more of a bartering thing. You cast one figure they cast another and back and forth until you both settle on a figure you can live with. If your buying a house, I talked today with a realitor friend of mind, as I'm buying another 40 acres. She informed me that now is the perfect time to buy as prices are at rock bottom right now. Don't procrastanate, deal now while prices are at their lowest. I'm getting a smoking deal on that land. So consult a realitor now, you don't have to buy, but you can get some excellent information.
Now, I have never heard of a wedding costing that much, unless it was the queen herself getting hitched. The idea above was to let her shop around, an excellent idea, puts the ball in her court, specially if you mention to her your saving money for a new home for her...guilt
the dowery, I've been told is an old custom that is outdated. If it is that much, you won't need red envelopes, but rather a red breifcase to carry all that money. Be frugal, for all we know this is a test to see how stinking rich you wish you were. She's testing you to see if you know how to handle money? Gosh, for two grand in china should buy you one hell of a wedding, if it dont, somthing is wrong...
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200,000 rmb or a wedding - Do I get 1/3 of China thrown in as well for the money?
Willy
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I think that this is a very delicate matter.... If you put the thing like this: All the money we can save at our wedding we can use buying our house / apartment later...All the money we can save will help our kids in the future to get a better life... I doesn't have the Nobel prize in understanding a woman but I think this will be a natural thinking for a woman who is starting a new life...
Like I wrote in Philip's thread it must not be very expensive. My wife told me that our wedding was about 25 000 yuan and we had 70 guests. It was a normal wedding in China..
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Irish, don't worry.
I am sure I am the only one having to deal with this dilemma.
Doesn't make it easy for me, but at least I have her brother on my side.
She said 200000. I say 20000 (with her brother's endorsement)
If she has lost face through this, I cannot come up with the difference to restore it. She has lost some trust in me, but I have not changed in my feelings or in my intentions one little bit, so I have nothing to reproach myself for, except perhaps not telling her that I am not a rich man.
I have stood my ground and told her that I want to register our marriage in December, and have the wedding meal in April. She seems to have accepted this. I'll let you know when I see her on Tuesday. She may have taken a contract out on me and I may be in for a tough ride. Bigbutt, if you in Changsha, you may have to cover my butt!
There may be trouble ahead, but while there's moonlight and music and love and romance, let's face the music and dance.
So, Irish, take my situation as wholly unrepresentative. Forget about my freakish situation. Sunny is a whole other kettle of poisson. After your wallet experience, you can be assured that you have nothing to worry about with your little bowl of sunnyshine.
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Danny,
I have got to disagree with you big time on this!! To agree with a sum of money totalling 200000RMB is just ludicrous to save her Face. She can have a more than good wedding for 2000 to 3000 Euros and even a lot less. There are plenty of Married guy's here now, that are not ignorant about such matters.
David
If that is what I said, or meant to say, then I agree with you. I did not mean to suggest that he agree with the 200,000 RMB sum. I would never agree to a figure like that. That is a marriage breaking amount of money in my opinion. If my YaYa demanded a marriage costing that sum, I would attempt to talk it through in the way I have suggested in my post, but if she insisted on spending that much money on a wedding I would not proceed with the marriage - not only because it is a waste of money, but for what it says about her.
I just meant to say that the way of dealing with the situation would be to step back from the matter and consider it as a problem for the family as a whole, rather than just an argument about setting an arbitrary limit.
Thanks for your response.
Danny