China Romance
General Discussion and Useful Links => Newbies Corner => Topic started by: Draydis on March 13, 2010, 05:47:34 pm
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Hi everyone, I recently joined the forum and this is my first post :)
I've been communicating for the past 3 or so months with a girl on Chnlove, the last 3 numbers of her profile id are 236. She doesn't speak more than a few words of English so we've been talking via EMF's, which yeah are pricey.
Before about a month ago, she always turned away my requests for her normal email address or to talk on QQ or webcam or for me to send her a text msg, she said she wanted to keep using the translation service so the "meaning of our conversations isn't lost", and says she doesn't use messaging like QQ or msn. When I asked her if she could go onto webcam with me (this was a couple days before Chinese New Year started), she said she was too busy due to work and the upcoming New Year, and might have time after it. She hasn't mentioned it since though.
Then I joined the forum here and read about various scams by translators or agencies, and because I already thought it odd that she didn't seem like she wanted to move away from the EMF's, I sent her a message asking her to send me an email from her normal address, and asking her for a couple "natural" photos, since all the ones on her profile and all the ones she has sent me appear to have been done by a studio. She sent me a normal email with a couple words, which was fine, and told me she doesn't own a camera, and that she'd already sent me a "natural" photo of her.. the one to which she was referring was one she'd sent me a couple weeks before, of her at work, which to me looks like it was posed but I can't be certain.
I asked her if she had any pics of her family, she said she has none, because her family doesn't like their pictures being taken due to a superstition.
Maybe I'm just being paranoid, but does anyone else think it strange for her to not have a camera? Or for her to not have any pics of herself out doing things with friends, etc? The messages I get from her are ok, although usually don't contain much new information. From what she says in her messages, it sounds like it's really her, and not the translator, communicating with me. We've talked about me going over to China this summer to visit her, and she seems fine with that and even suggested a couple places she'd like to go with me.
On one hand I feel she's genuine, on the other I can't shake the feeling that I'm being played with.
Does anyone have any suggestions on things I might ask her so I can be certain? Or advice from your own experiences? Anything would be appreciated, the EMF's are starting to take a big chunk out of my pay, I don't mind paying them if she's genuine, but again.. I'm not certain.
Thanks,
D.
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Draydis
At some point in time, most of us here have been through this drama with Ladies from CHNLove.....I am sure you will see this as you read the many posts on the subject.
On the one hand, CHNLove will fight you pretty hard to keep the EMF traffic going because it is their revenue at stake.
On the other hand, after a period of time, if you get real pushy they will usually give in and allow you some more personal communication such as email or even web-cam.
You cannot know at this time whether it is your Lady or CHNLove translators who are stonewalling. So as long as you keep sending EMF's, nothing will change.
Sad to say, there are only 2 options.........
1) Get tough..."either we get on to more personal communication or I will disappear", or
2) Get on a plane and go and see for yourself !!!
Either way, it is a risk !!!
The real problem right now is that you have no idea if the Lady you are corresponding with has any idea what you say in your EMF's.....she may well be getting a fully "fluffed" version from the translator !!
You will note from all the posts that some Bros have fully completed their relationship with a wonderful woman based solely on EMF's and ultimately, a personal meeting.
You will also note that many Bros have been burned by this route !!!
From my experience, I dont think there is a person left in China who does not have a mobile phone...and they all LOVE taking and getting photos, especially of family and family gatherings !!
One last caution....this lady may be a little hesitant to get more personal with you because she may have had communications in the past from Men who were not serious in their search and she has been let down...thus she is being cautious with you.
I regret that there does not seem to be a cast-iron answer to your questions...these questions have been asked many times by many Bros and we just gotta work through it and hopefully win the big prize :icon_cheesygrin:
At this moment, she appears to have declined any type of further communication, so for me...its a big red flag...but you may want to pursue it a little further before jumping !!
DavidE
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well you now have her email so continue to write her there and see
what develops. i would send her an emf saying you will keep in contact
with her there in the private email box and see what develops.
one interesting note i dont understand why she doesnt have pictures
of her and the family as they are very big on that. they even take pics with
the cell phone when they are out and about. they do have translation on
there computers so she could write from this.
just try some different angles and see what happens you do have 3 months
with her were is she from how old? some of this plays into this also
also an admendment to my post--- David did hit on a point that
maybe she has had communication in the past and the men didnt
follow up with a visit. we talk about the agencies and ladies here
but that also is an issue were men come and go for whatever
reason leaving the woman to wonder what happened??
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Draydis,
What David E has told you is the basic truth of the matter.
The Photo thing gave me a real chuckle, as Dave said, virtually all mobiles in China have camera facility, and are used prolifically ALL the time!! Not only that, you can find photo studio's on every street corner in every city throughout China!! The Chinese like nothing better than to pose for a photo, ...hahaha!!
I wouldn't leave it too long before getting a little more insistent on requesting other forms of communication, the longer you leave it, the harder it will be, ...and in more than just one way!!!
As mentioned, both of you could be getting the fluff treatment from the translator, which is why it is so important to have additional means of communication between you both...
David.....
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What agency is she with, Draydis? Maybe some of the brothers have some experience with the agency and could give you a bit more info.
Also, what David E. said above, and which Ted seconded, could also be a factor, depending on her personal situation. Maybe she's been burned in the past. My lady has been, so it can be an issue I know.
I don't have all that much experience at this yet myself, but I have learned both from the ladies I've written and through the brothers here that many of them live a distance from the agency they are with. So it's not easy for them to go to the agencies, and they get their emfs read to them (and they respond to them) over the phone. What I did, and which you might consider, is asking her how she gets and responds to your emfs.
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Thanks for the info and advice, I really appreciate it.
I hadn't considered the possibility that she may have been burned in the past.. maybe she was, I'll try and find out at some future point when it feels like the right time to ask about it.
Actually, I sent her an EMF a couple hours ago and in it I asked her how the EMF system works with her. I also mentioned again that I'd like to try a phone call next weekend, or on a day around then that's convenient for her. I've been trying to learn some Chinese over the past few months and am at the point where I can keep up a (very) basic conversation.
I'm not sure where she lives in relation to the Agency, but I know she works about a 30-minute bus ride from them, because I sent her a rose on Valentine's Day, to the address she had given me early on (the Agency's address).
By the way, the Agency is "Nanning OuYuan Marriage Information Consulting Service Co. Ltd." I've read a lot of posts on the forums here and it seems like this Agency is a pretty good one, I haven't found any remarks about people being scammed. I'm pretty sure her messages to me have been fluffed up though, based on some differences in the way her messages ended before and after the time I voiced my concerns and asked her to go on webcam and send me a couple normal pics. Then again, mine to her are probably being fluffed up somehow too.
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Haha Draydis,
I believe your nick comes from Battlestar Galactica? Are you worried, maybe, umm.... she's Cylon? :icon_cheesygrin:
As a rule if her messages are "ho hum, nothin new" either she's boring, or translator writes them. Get specific, ask detailed stuff, that only she can answer, it's long past the point when I would have gotten direct contact or dropped her. The longer you leave it, the more she/translator thinks you're a perpetual virtual penpal.
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What I have noticed here is that until the woman really get to know you they tend to hold back on information. Especially if they have children or family. They too can become involved with an internet relationship if it expands to other methods of contact. And the women could well be protecting them. A lot of women have had other men contact them and have suddenly heard from them not more as the men started talking to several women and then cut down the number.
They may be able to speak a few words of English but they do not get much of an opportunity of using it. They are very concious that they may be pronouncing words wrong or they will not understand you. They hear different English accents in films and think 'I have been saying it wrong' then they hear the same word from another and they sound different again.
I first starting talking with a women who had a lot of English and we could have conversations but she often had trouble understanding everything I say. Teds wife, who I have met many times also has difficulty at times in understanding me. The do not like speaking in English unless they really have to.
But all this will not allay your fears. You do have to reach a point where you must tell her (and the translator) that unless there is some direct contact then you will continue to have a fear that she is not real and if she wants to continue contact then there must be some indication on her part to show that she wants to continue.
Face to face contact is best and as every one knows that when I came here things did not work out. But I always say that you CANNOT build a relationship by internet, telephone, webcam, QQ, Messenger or any other method that I did not try with my first lady. If anyone says they can then they are living in a dream world (Maybe I am as I have a thread on that!!!) and are probably in love with being in love.
Willy
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I agree with everything David E said. For me, I question several points...points that others have also mentioned. No pictures of her or the family? I have a tough time buying into that. Like David5o said...they all have a mobile phone. My wife has three. I am sure all three take pictures as well. And she carries a small camera in her purse.
Also, I have a hard time believing that a Chinese woman doesn't use communication programs like MSN or QQ. Is there anyone in China that doesn't have a QQ account? Hell, I remember hearing the QQ sounds coming from people's mobile phones, because they had QQ there.
Personally, I have a bunch of red flags on this situation. But, maybe she has been burned in the past. Follow your heart, but listen to your brain. Ask questions from her, and feel free to ask us questions here. This could very well be your best resource for help.
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If a woman over time does not give you her personal contact information, then it's a big red flag. As per advice here, they all have cell phones and almost all have QQ. If you send them text messages in Chinese and they do not respond or if their e-mails don't say much it's time to cut your losses.
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you did say you have her regular email right? well start writing there and see what happens
or is it an agency generated email box??
like martin said follow your heart but listen to the brain
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odysseus007: yup my nick comes from Battlestar Galactica :)
ttwjr32: the email address I have for her is a yahoo.cn account, so I assume it's a personal one and not agency-generated.
So I sent her an EMF last night mentioning again I'd like to try a phone call with her, and telling her that I think my Chinese is good enough now for a basic conversation. She replied "I haven't prepared well for it so far, you know, it is my first time to talk to a foreigner on the phone, I never did it before so I am nervous. I prefer we talk later, when my English is better".
Maybe the translator left out the part where I said we could speak in Chinese. 3 months ago she said she would try to learn more English so we could talk one on one, and apparently she hasn't learned any over that time, so I don't think she has any real intention of learning more.
I used my last credit to read her reply, so my plan is to buy 4 more credits in a couple days and EMF her something along the lines that it seems to me like she's not serious, and I'll ask her if she had bad experiences in the past with other guys. I'll say that I'm not going to buy any more credits and that if she wants to continue with me, we'll have to start communicating by other means. I don't want it to sound like I'm giving her an ultimatum though.
I hope it doesn't backfire, but I guess that's a risk I'll have to take.
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Draydis,
Like Ted suggested, i would try her email route, it's probably an agency controlled email address anyway. If it is, then it will get translated both ways by the translator, the same way as the EMF's that your paying for now.
From there, i would then start working towards web cam/messenger, via QQ, Yahoo, MSN, AOL, etc....
Most agency controlled emails are ....her profile name and normally a Yahoo.com or a 126.com account....
David....
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Thanks, I'll try that and see how it goes.
Her email is pretty much her profile name and the yahoo.cn, but I'm not sure if it's agency controlled, because the replies I've gotten from her on it when I've emailed her there in the past have been in extremely broken English, and only a very few words. Unless that's how they do it with agency-controlled email.. ahh now I'm just getting paranoid ;)
The next couple days will tell. Thanks again everyone for all the input and advice, I really appreciate it.
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Draydis your probably just being paranoid.If her email address starts with her name.There is a good chance it is NOT agency controlled.
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Draydis,
the email is hers if it has her name in it. and in the past if she answered you in a
bad broken english then it was her and not the translator. and only a few words.
i would go with the plan of the final 4 credits and see what happens. write to her
in her personal email after she recieves the last 2 emf's so to give her time to get
them from the translator. see what happens. i personally dont like the 'when my english
gets better' so she really doesnt want to talk with you for a couple of years? because
it will take that long. this stinks of as the old saying goes "something in denmark stinks"
this is why the agencies dont like to give out their numbers or contact info. if it is them
doing something then oh well on to the next. they made as much as they could with this
one. and the mother earth ship in hong kong well they dont care nor will they do anything
other than write you some fluffy letter back.
changes are coming and will soon be announced here in the forum and you could all who
are looking be in better hands than these chnlove agencies
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Use Google translate and make sure you use lots of full stops between the words like .......How are.you?... I am having. a good day.... you are. very beautiful.... etc etc. It gives the translation much less chance of getting it wrong if everything is in short sentences.
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Cam is right make the words short and to the point. Do not use collequiel words that may only be used in your country or even your distict.
My wife tells me that a lot of women here are scared to speak on telephone as your Chinese may be Mandarin and she speak Cantonese or visa versa. They do not want to sound stupid by misunderstanding you or you her and then you going somewhere else.
This could well have been an idea situation that would have been avoided by the proposed agency that Ted gave details of.
Willy
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It's not that difficult to communicate using Google translate. Just keep EMFs for important stuff.
A Chinese lady without 10,000 photos of herself is very rare :icon_cheesygrin:.
If a lady won't make the extra effort to communicate then it's a big red flag as far as I'm concerned - you have a wonder if they're really serious about the relationship.
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A Chinese lady without 10,000 photos of herself is very rare :icon_cheesygrin:.
OMG, ain't THAT the truth!
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Give you a piece of suggestion. You do not book a flight ticket, but tell her that you have already booked a ticket to visit her. If she is real ur lady, she would like to meet you. If she is the translator, she might not let you go there coz no one is going to meet you there. They will be afraid of you to lodge a complaint to the Chnlove headquarter.
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Give you a piece of suggestion. You do not book a flight ticket, but tell her that you have already booked a ticket to visit her. If she is real ur lady, she would like to meet you. If she is the translator, she might not let you go there coz no one is going to meet you there. They will be afraid of you to lodge a complaint to the Chnlove headquarter.
The problem with this suggestion, is...what if she is real? Now he said he is coming, and does not have a ticket.
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He can say that because of the weather, he has to cancell the flight and will try to visit her next time.
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He can say that because of the weather, he has to cancell the flight and will try to visit her next time.
I don't think that basing a relationship on lies is the best course of action. This is my opinion. If he is being lied to, then he needs to find out. But by lying as well, then he is not better than the agency.
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I agree with Dinger. Starting off with a lie is just asking for trouble later. Plus blaming the weather is not really a good enough excuse. This is a tough situation. I have been there. There are a lot of red flags as has been pointed out. The best course of action is what you are doing. Plus the best advice was go with your heart but lead with your brain.
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Her email is pretty much her profile name and the yahoo.cn, but I'm not sure if it's agency controlled
I will place a bet this is an agency made email address! Anybody like to place a wager? I'm curious is her profile name Chinese or English...first not last name.
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Draydis, you know with the info you've given about your girl, her profile is easy to find. I think the email address is probably setup by the agency ... my experience is they all use QQ and more. If it is her personal address, then she uses yahoo messenger, try that route. But if the address sounds like firstname-in-English.surnamename and some number, the agency set it up. My experience with that agency is that they will block direct contact as long as possible, it takes complaining and threats to get direct contact, I tried on a couple of occasions, always the same story.
She is young ... more risk of a scam than with older ones.
My 2 cents ...
Frank
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Draydis,
From what you say about her email address, it sounds pretty certain that it is an agency controlled address. That's not to say that the lady can't use that email address she can. She has access to all that address offers, just that the agency is aware of all that goes through it, as the translator has the password access along with your lady.
As for the broken English mails you had from her in the past, ...that could be her trying her hand at English, or the translator trying to put you off direct contact.
David
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telling her you are coming to see her and not having a real ticket and then
finding she is real and telling her you cancelled becuase of something is terrible
advise. this is part of the problem when a legitimate lady is hesitant to give you
her contact info. they have been told and done to like this a few times or the man
disappears. i would just tell her point blank like he did in the last email and see what
happens. and move on iif you have to. there are to many ladies who are more willing
to talk to you. NO--pics or qq well that is all bu****** as everyone here has that
and then some. 3 months and still these excuses well just take the hard stand and
see what happens
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If your going to lie...send an EMF and say that your there and want to meet immediately...why bother with the weather cancel flight? Like the men here have pointed out: a lie is no good...why bother lowering yourself to a translator's level??? If this woman is truly interested, she will do the direct contact! Everything you have written seems to be translator generated crap! Give the woman a chance but give agency an ultimatum...send email or emf and write to translator(at the bottom) and let translator know your intentions! You can also do this in a mature/assertive manner and maybe a positive outcome will happen! Good luck!
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However tough it may be, you should frame your response to her on the basis that it is going to her Agency...she may NEVER even know what you write or have written in the past !!!
If the Agency is holding you out so that they keep the EMF slow drip going, then your ultimatum will finish it...because your Lady was never real.
If your Lady is genuinely the one who is resisting further contact with excuses like "poor English' or "no photos", then you have got to be suspicious that she is not serious.
I met my Ming through a different site, with no translators in the middle. Her first letter was in poor English and had obviously been done with Google translate. I suggested QQ and her response was "happy to do that but be aware my English is not good, but I have a translator program on my computer and I am very keen to meet you on QQ."
With the second letter she sent about 20 photos of herself. When I went to meet her in Chengdu, she had hundreds of photos of herself and her family......as they all do !!! When in Chengdu, she was in charge of photos with my camera....in 9 days she took 608 photos...cant tell me that Chinese women are not in love with all things photo !!!
Having been through the same "dramas" as you with CHNLove...I can sure tell you that most of this reluctance to communicate further is Agency generated....please note: I said "most" because we do know of instances where everything went just fine with the valuable help of a good Agency and its Staff...but these seem to be rare as rocking horse s**t.
David
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They will be afraid of you to lodge a complaint to the Chnlove headquarter.
:icon_cheesygrin::icon_cheesygrin::icon_cheesygrin: Chnlove Hong Kong showing an interest in a complaint :icon_cheesygrin::icon_cheesygrin::icon_lol:
OH God my sides are killing me :icon_lol: - Sorry Zhuzhu but that is the funniest thing I have heard this week.LOL:icon_lol:
Willy
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Her email is pretty much her profile name and the yahoo.cn, but I'm not sure if it's agency controlled
I will place a bet this is an agency made email address! Anybody like to place a wager? I'm curious is her profile name Chinese or English...first not last name.
Well...My new lady is not on or in any agency, and her address ends in ( .cn)
this was always my belief that the agency controlled address ended like this too...
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.cn only denotes that it is the Chinese version of Yahoo that was signed up through. Like the Americans are .com, the Canadians are .ca, etc.
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Our extension should be .Eh! :icon_cheesygrin:
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Mike... Wait til you see the latest Timmy's commercial.
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Her email is pretty much her profile name and the yahoo.cn, but I'm not sure if it's agency controlled
I will place a bet this is an agency made email address! Anybody like to place a wager? I'm curious is her profile name Chinese or English...first not last name.
Well...My new lady is not on or in any agency, and her address ends in ( .cn)
this was always my belief that the agency controlled address ended like this too...
Hello Mate!
If u really look at what I written, you will notice I asked question about her name from agency...more than likely, if they gave her a English name(first name), this is an agency controlled email (if woman has profile name: Susie Qing and her email is susie145@yahoo.cn)...most emails from here have .cn at the end...this wasn't what I implied! :icon_cheesygrin:
P.S. you can pay two credits to get woman's email...hahahahaha!
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Well, it seems she was a fake after all, and the email address was in fact an agency-controlled one. I remember seeing a post somewhere on here which listed the id's of girls who are scammers, so that other guys could be warned... I can't find the post now, does anyone know the link? I want to add her to the list.
Thanks,
D.
Her email is pretty much her profile name and the yahoo.cn, but I'm not sure if it's agency controlled
I will place a bet this is an agency made email address! Anybody like to place a wager? I'm curious is her profile name Chinese or English...first not last name.
Her profile name is Chinese, but in the English format, like.. Firstname Lastname, but the first name is in Chinese.
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Draydis I'm sorry to hear this.How did you come to the conclusion.That the lady is a scam?
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Draydis
May I add to what Maxx is saying here........
We often jump into "the Lady is a scammer" because of all the obvious problems with communication we go through. In my post here I mentioned that the lady herself may not even be aware of what "she" had written to you or what "you " had replied back to her.
It is just possible that the Agency did all the communication as an EMF generation excercise.
We should be careful about automatically assigning "scammer" to these Ladies, after all , a scammer is a Woman who seeks money from us and has no interest in a relationship of any sort....this is much what we find on most of the Russian Dating Sites these days.
In reality, the label "scammer" might be applied more to the CHNLove Agencies who strive for EMF revenue at any cost. I have a suspicion that the Ladies themselves are as much the innocent victims as we are. If we condem many "innocent" Ladies with the scammer label, we may be doing the wrong thing by decent Women who only want the same as us...a genuine and lasting relationship with a Laowei.
But as usual, it is dammed difficult to prove either way !!!
David