China Romance
General Discussion and Useful Links => Ask An Experienced Member => Topic started by: Lain on July 07, 2010, 01:06:52 am
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Ok members, been along time since I have posted here and MANY things have moved along with relationship. I returned from Zhongshan / Xiaolan about a month ago after going there to spend 12 days with my lady. We have been communicating virtually every day now via QQ and I have even managed to create a fairly decent page in Qzone to share some things.....very hard when you cant use Google translate for the website.
Either way, I have chosen to advance our relationship and make the move there to live for a year. Originally I was going to attend a language school while living there, but after some long chats with my lady she said that I should simply spend some time living here...getting used to the culture and just spend some time living there to even see if can make an adjustment to life there. This is due to the fact that I will be moving there to live if we choose to get married. She has no desire to move to the US, and to be honest I even prefer the idea as I had a great time while there..albeit a short trip, I spent much of my time simply checking out the normal places rather than all the tourist traps.
So here I am looking into what I need to do in order to move there and I am reading about how to apply for whats called a "temporary residence permit" which can allow me to live there for 6-12 months without having to rely on a multi-entry Visa that will require me to leave and re-enter the country almost every month.....which is a pain to say the least, but Hong Kong is not to far so not a huge deal.
However my problem is that it appears that I will not be able to apply for this permit until after I am there..? If anyone has gone through this process please let me know what I can expect. I will be looking to move in October and wish to rent an apartment, but from what I can tell I will need to stay at a hotel until I can secure the temp residence permit...then find an apartment.
It seams that virtually everything I read about this process contradicts what I read on another website...so I was hoping to get some assistance. I will be looking to move to Xiaolan, but from what can tell I will need to apply in Zhongshan?
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Lain,
you should check with the chinese consulate were you live. they have just upped the temp residency to be able to apply for a two year one now. but that is requiring a medical check up. i received mine 19 days after i got here but i was married and we own a house here which made it quite simple. this year i need to do the medical check before i apply for the 2 year visa. the cost here is 458 rmb for that and there is only 1 hospital that does foreigners and its in Guangzhou for Guangdong province. unless your married or you have a job here then i do believe you cant apply for this in Guangdong province but i could be wrong which is why i said check with the chinese consulate were you live. the usa embassy is not going to be able to help you with this. From what i read on the papers i picked up at the PSB building foriegners coming in to do this need that medical certificate before arriving. the ones here can go to the hospital in Guangzhou. like Willy in Zhongshan needs to come here and do his so we will probably go the same day. Its a pretty simple procedure, blood,urine,exrays height weight the main things their looking for are TB AND AIDS . not sure of the cost of a 2 year visa but a 1 year one is 940rmb so with the checkup the total cost will be 1398rmb i hope its not 940 plus940 plus 458 but if it is oh well not much i can do. the next time after this go around i can apply for a permanent one which is a little more but you never have to do all this again. they told me you have to be here for 3 years minimum for the permanent one hope this helps
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Very interesting stuff, especially for us mere mortals planing on making the move to China. Will be following this thread with great interest. I have a cunning plan to run past Wendy. I think I will be in a financial position to move by the beginning of December and conducting the TESOL course online from there. My mum wants me to have my 40th BD here before I move. Does anyone know how long the application will take. If it is a while I might have to apply the day that I get back to Sydney.
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Lain,
Why would they give you a temporary residents visa? You are not working in China, you do not own a business here and your not married to a Chinese citizen. That leaves you squarely in the L visa or tourist visa class. If you are married to a Chinese citizen you get an extended L visa for up to 2 years, this does not give you the right to work in China and is not a Residents visa they are two separate things. For us mere mortals to get a residence visa you need to have first of all a Z or work visa then apply for your Foreign experts certificate and then take this to the PSB and they will issue you with a residence visa valid for 6 months. Willy is the man to ask about renting apartments here.
Jason, my advice would be to come over here on the longest tourist visa you can get your hands on and then look for work teaching. If your successful and I see no reason why you would not be, you will have to skip over to Hong Kong to get your Z visa. The Z visa cancels out your L visa and is only valid for 1 month, to get this you have to have papers from the school that offers you work. You can not apply for it with out them. Then the school will get your Foreign experts certificate, actually it's a little blue book and this will get you a residency visa. Some schools will try to get you to teach on an F or business visa, but that's another story. After you are married and have your little red book you can have your medical and go along to the PSB and apply for your extended L visa, it took me 5 days to get mine and was no problem at all, this was before I found work. All you can apply for back home is your L visa or if you have a firm offer of work a Z visa or an F or business visa. Don't worry it's not as complex as it sounds ! Best of luck to you both, I'm sure you won't regret moving to China
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This is why I came here to ask for advice.
I was told that I could get a temporary residence permit under some circumstances. Yes you are correct, I do not and most likely will not work there as my company is internet based in the US and it really does not matter where I live as my company is all "server side" as its called. However that said, I am not against getting a "token" job if it can expedite the process of obtaining a residence permit.
I am all but certain that I will have to deal with my 12 month tourist visa, and I have sent a request to the embassy where my Visa was issues last time to request the time in country be extended to 90-days per visit. I am told this is possible, but will most likely only be extended to 60-days per visit.....which is still better than every 30-days.
My concerns are that unless I know that I can stay for at very least 6 months, I may have a really hard time getting an apartment as all my research so far points to lease agreements that are almost always a year..or longer! I have found several places where I can get short term leases but they are usually extended stay hotels which are exceptionally expensive, or rat holes that I will not live in.
The problem I am having is that I cannot seem to get much done until I am "on the ground" so to speak once I am there. This is making it really hard to decide what to do about taking care of business on this side of the pond. I am in the process of selling most of my household items and my vehicle. I have a handful of items I wish to bring with....but due to the shipping costs I am hesitant to crate it all up until I know how long I will be able to stay. There are things that I will need, and things that I would like...how long I can stay will greatly determine what I bring.
I am keenly aware that there is no guarantee that there that I may always be allowed re-entry on my tourist visa, even though so long as I stay out of trouble there is most likely not going to be a problem.....however if I set up an apartment, move even my basic personal effects to the apartment and get denied entry back...I am sort of screwed. :(
My business needs will require me to take my computer and related business stuff as I work from my home which I will continue to do there as I do here. I cannot risk losing these items, so I am simply making my best effort to ensure that I can stay for a given time...even if for only 6 months. I was originally going to attend a school for Mandarin and was to get a JW-201 cert and get a student Visa...but my lady thought it best that I simply take one step at a time, see how it goes for the first few months and if all goes well for both our relationship, and seeing if I can adapt to life there (fairly sure no problem) then become a student.....etc.
Just weighing my options, doing my homework and getting plans in place....October will be here before I know it and that is when I am coming.
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Lain,
coming from the states my first visit to china i was only given a 90 day visa but after that i applied for a year with multiple entries
and had no problem recieving that one each time. so apply for that one as you have already been here.
as far as renting a place most will want you to pay in advance so work out a 6 month rental with who you talk with or have your
lady freind have this set up for you before you come. you could always send her the money to pay for it before you get here.
the rentals in zhongshan are most reasonable as having been to Willy's place which is very nice and about half of what you would
pay in Guangzhou. in fact he could get the same lady to get you a place there if you ask him she is a really good lady and will find
you a good place
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Actually she has already been helping me to find a place, and giving me feedback on the places I find online. However I will be in a smaller area called Xiaolan, which does not have as many places to rent as Zhongshan. Its about a 30 minute bus ride away, but I really like the area and its where she lives. What I am really hating about these places online is the complete lack of either pictures, and in some cases addresses that I can find using ANY map services online....that was one thing I noticed during my visit was the lack of easily found building addresses...guess you have to know what to look for?
The costs so far of the places I have considered are just fine with me...in fact one place I found is only 2100-RMB ($300 US) for a 2 bedroom (furnished) and my plan was to actually prepay for the first 6 months up front so I do not have to hassle with it once I am there. I require a high speed internet connection for my business and VOIP (phone) The second bedroom I was going to use as my office like I do here.
Glad to read that you had no issues with the multi entry visa...it just has me nervous as I mentioned, being refused entry once I am moved in would create a major situation with my business that has me wanting some sort of assurances. As mentioned what I will most likely do is fly over, spend a week or two at a hotel while I settle on an apartment having filtered my choices before I arrive and then have the shipping company air freight my stuff once I have an actual "address"
I guess all I can really do now is wait to see what the embassy says in reply to my inquiry....and hope for the best once I am there....for everything! :)
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Hi Lain,
Have you considered applying for a 12 month multiple entry F or business visa. If you have your own business and can supply a:-
" Business Letter or Invitation Letter:"
" A Business Letter from your company or an invitation letter from the Chinese company, Letter must address to "Consulate of China" explaining the purpose of the trip, guaranteeing financial support for you while in China"
It looks quite possible that you would receive it. According to Visa express in the US it costs 160$ and a 69$ service fee. They even say you can get it the same day for a higher fee! Here's the link:-
http://www.visaexpress.net/ (http://www.visaexpress.net/)
I'm sure if you talk to these people they will tell you exactly what needs to be in the letter and you can go from there. Maybe even set up a cheap off the shelf company just for this purpose. Just some idea's I was thinking about, not sure how viable they are. Worth an e-mail I would have thought. Best of luck................
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Hi Lain,
Have you considered applying for a 12 month multiple entry F or business visa. If you have your own business and can supply a:-
" Business Letter or Invitation Letter:"
" A Business Letter from your company or an invitation letter from the Chinese company, Letter must address to "Consulate of China" explaining the purpose of the trip, guaranteeing financial support for you while in China"
It looks quite possible that you would receive it. According to Visa express in the US it costs 160$ and a 69$ service fee. They even say you can get it the same day for a higher fee! Here's the link:-
http://www.visaexpress.net/ (http://www.visaexpress.net/)
I'm sure if you talk to these people they will tell you exactly what needs to be in the letter and you can go from there. Maybe even set up a cheap off the shelf company just for this purpose. Just some idea's I was thinking about, not sure how viable they are. Worth an e-mail I would have thought. Best of luck................
Waite a minute....your saying that I can have my own business create a "Business Letter or Invitation Letter" so that I can enter on a business visa?? I was under the impression that this type of letter could only be issued from an internal "Chinese business" ??
If this is a possibility than that does indeed change the scope of my plans, because my company does engage in international B2B trade and it was part of my longer term business plan to export items via my company from China should I get married and stay there. In fact when I was there on my last visit I visited a few companies that are in my line of business and I am an authorized dealer for an international company that has one dealer located in China. I may be able to get them to issue a letter for "consulting" ???
See, there is always a way....now to investigate how may be able to have my own company issue such a letter....If I can? In the end I will be doing business there should I get married and stay...guess there is no reason to wait to get started on "researching" my business opportunities.
Thanks....now the question is can I pull this off in less than 80 days?
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Lain,
if your sure you will get married just apply for a 1 year multiple visa entry from the states and after you marry apply for the
1 year L VISA WITH multiple entries mine was applied for 9 days after we married and issued to me a week later.
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I am getting confused here.
I have a visa that was aquired from the PSB. That is now due to expire and need to be renewed in two weeks. That is multi entry and I do not have to leave China.
I ALSO haved a Temporary Residents Permit which allows me to live here. When I was in Zhuhai I fell foul of the law when I answered a knock at my apartment door and found the police there. I had to report to the local Police Station and register fo a TYemp residents Permit. Which I renew after each Visa is issued.
Now some are saying that a Temp Residences Permit is not required. The Police tell me it is required. I will also make sure that I always have one as it saves carrying a passport around.
Willy
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Hi Willy,
I'm also confused, nothing new I know. A couple of questions.You have a visa from the PSB, was this given to you after you got married? and is it an L visa. Also what is the "Temporary Residents Permit" you have? Does it actually say" Temporary " and what form does it take a separate book or a sticker in your passport? I understand about having to register at the police station if your not staying in a hotel but I've never come across a Temporary Residents Permit, is it issued by the police? I have a blue " Resident Permit for Foreigners in the People Republic of China" stuck in my passport. While this is valid I do not need a visa of any kind, but to get it I had to have a Z visa that was valid for 1 month! Thanks............
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This is why I have been working so hard to find the best solutions.....there seems to be many contradictions when reading about Visa's & Residency Permits, and as best I can tell.....it depends on where you live as each province seems to have its own regulations for residency.
The really screwy thing that I found recently was an application to become a Chinese Citizen!!....I cannot tell you how many times I have read that there is no such thing as getting citizenship there, but here is the link. http://crj.gdga.gov.cn/zjzs/ (http://crj.gdga.gov.cn/zjzs/)
This is also where I found the Temporary Residence Permit....nice to read it BEFORE I get there and get some details as to how to plan my trip so that any issues are addressed now while I am still here in the US.
To clarify....It was explained to me that a person can apply for a temporary residence permit if there is a valid reason, such as caring for a family member, business reasons, short term education or advanced study courses, and a few other mostly related to family. The temporary residence permit overrides the Visa in that so long as the permit is valid you can stay inside the country even if your Visa only has say a single entry 30-day in country visit, or even a multi-entry. This is what I desire to get, as I will be setting up my business while there and I do not like the idea that I may be refused re-entry when my computers and documents are still in China.
If a temporary residence permit has been issued, and renewed for 2 years than you can apply for one that is valid for up to 2 years at a time. After that if a permit has been re-issued for 5 years, you may then apply for a permanent residence permit that is valid for 10 years at a time. You can also apply for a permanent residence permit if you are married to a Chinese lady, or have a business that operates inside China. The business part is rather vague in that it states there must be a "significant contribution" to the Chinese economy...which I guess means that you must have a big company that employs many people...or you are willing to pay a big bribe?
As for marriage....well, that's still the big question and while that is the ultimate goal, I am still not so sure that she is the one ~ but I do hope~ So I am not going to make any plans for getting a Visa, residence permit or anything along those lines that is based on marriage. When (if) that becomes the basis for my being there..I will apply for such paperwork then.
The new law is that unless I stay in a hotel, which automatically registers my stay with the PSB I must apply for a residence permit within 24 hours of entry. Which is fine, as I will be living in a hotel for the first few weeks I am there and will not sign a lease for the apartment until I am approved for the residence permit, which I am hoping that I will get as I will be coming on a 12-month multi-entry business visa. I am going to ask for a 6-month temporary residence permit...and I will actually be looking into business opportunities and may even file to start an Asian division of my company?
Either way, I have attached the Citizenship PDF.....not sure what all it says..(Chinese only) and a temporary residence permit.
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Ahh China, confusion rules!
I think we are talking about 2 different things here even though they have the same name! The first " Residence Permit'" below is for people who are employed by a company/school and sets out the requirements:-
For foreigners who want to stay in China for a short term will be asked to apply for a temporary or long-term residence permit,
1. Temporary residence permit
Basic application materials needed
1. A valid passport and visa;
2. Letter from the employer;
3. Certificate for accommodation registration;
4. Two recent 2-inch carnet color photos of uncapped portrait image;
For foreign experts, the following are also required:
(1) Expert Card;
(2) Certificate of health (exempted for those with validity period of temporary residence below one year).
For foreign students, the following are also required:
(1) Either JW201 or JW202 form;
(2) Certificate of health (exempted for those with validity period of temporary residence below half a year);
(3) Examination-approval form for off-campus accommodation (if applicable).
For performance staffs, the following are also required:
(1) Certificate of performance;
(2) Approval document from the Ministry of Culture.
Note: For those foreigners from the countries with mutual exemption of visa requirements, after they enter China, if they require staying for more than 30 days, they shall handle the procedures for temporary residence, the length of which shall not exceed 3 months.
2. Long-term residence permit
Application materials required
1. A valid passport and visa or residence permit;
2. Certificate of health (exempted for those foreigners with residence permit)
3. Two recent 2-inch carnet color photos of uncapped portrait image;
4. Attestation of the ID card and Work Experience of the Foreigner produced by his/her employer;
5. Certificate of honor or commendation certificate (photocopy);
Note: Depending on the different conditions of applicants, the following materials are also required
a. Applicant who has invested and established an enterprise in China shall submit the photocopy of the enterprise's business license (counterpart);
b. Urgently-needed technician or main contributor shall submit the Letter of Recommendation for Long-term Residential Qualification of Foreigners produced by competent municipal authorities or the photocopy of individual commendation certificate issued by the municipal government;
A person who is accompanied by spouse and child shall present a certificate of kinship.
Extension of temporary residence permit in China
Application materials required
1. A valid passport and the valid temporary residence permit;
2. Letter from the employer;
For experts, the following are also required
a. Expert Card;
b. Certificate of health.
For foreign students, the following are also required
a. School's official letter;
b. Certificate of health.
For performance staffs, the following are also required
a. Certificate of performance;
b. Approval document from the Ministry of Culture;
c. Certificate of health.
Now I think what Willy is talking about is:-
Temporary Residence Registration, Which allows you to live in your apartment without being subjected to fines.
All foreigners in China need to be registered with their local PSB (Public Security Bureau)
Who is affected?
Guests staying in Hotels and Serviced Apartments
Guests must be registered upon arrival with the PSB by the hotel and/or serviced apartment management company. Usually this procedure is automatic with input from the hotel being directly fed into the local PSB computer at the check-in procedure, with no additional action being required from the guest. However, daily checks are now in operation with the PSB physically visiting hotels to request copies of the hotels in-house guest list to make sure they match the PSB’s own records. If they do not, the hotel / serviced apartment will be fined RMB5,000 per missing entry. Hotel guests under these circumstances would not be fined. However it does mean that foreigners wishing to stay at an hotel in China must provide full passport and visa credentials in order to check in.
Expatriate Employees Living In Private Apartments
The apartment management company should be contacting foreign tenants / residents and requiring them to register with the local PSB. If this is not done, both the management company and the foreigner can be fined RMB5,000. It is important to note that this rule applies to any foreign person living in any apartment or private dwelling - even if it is for just for one night. If staying overnight or visiting friends in China, registration must be carried out upon arrival with the local PSB office responsible for the area within 24 hours of arrival.
Not the same thing at all.
Residence Permits as opposed to Residence registration,
It is not the visa but the residence permit that gives you the legal right to live in China. Once you arrive in China, you’ll have 30 days to secure your residence permit. Your initial visa will expire within a few months, but your residence permit will function like a multiple-entry visa, allowing you to leave the country and return without an additional visa as long as the permit is valid. Three types of residence permits can give you the legal right to live in China. Permanent residence permits, a.k.a. the new “green cards,” accompany the D visas and are renewable every 10 years. Temporary residence permits are for those staying more than six months but less than one year, such as visiting scholars or those coming for job training. The Foreigner Residence Permit, typically good for one year and renewable annually, is standard issue for the majority of foreigners working in China, though some (such as company executives, legal representatives, or investors) qualify for a permit that is good for two years. With a valid residence permit you are allowed to leave the country and return, even if your initial entry visa has expired.
Information required for a residence permit or a temporary residence permit, again this is not the registration permit that is sometimes called Residence Permit.
Guangdong Province
① One application form and three recent, bare-headed, full-faced, white-background color photos(size:32X40 cm);
② One copy of the applicant’s valid passport or other valid Travel certificates and visa( bring original certificates for inspection);
③ One valid Health Certificate(except for those under 16 years of the age) issued by the other citiy’s Entry-Exit Inspection and Quarantine Bureau of the People’s Republic of China.( Refered to as the same as hereinafter)
④ Temporary Accommodation Registration Form for Aliens registered with the public security station(except in hotels);
⑤ Upon the first application for an alien resident permit, the employer should provide the following: name, occupation, telephone number, fax number for the appropriate contact person, etc.;
⑥ The other requested Certificates;
⑦ Accommodation certificate: Certificate of the House Property (deed) of the applicant, or the Public Security Administration’s Permit for House Lodging or rental contract, or a rental contract for long term lodging in a hotel (bring the original certificates for inspection along with photocopies of all the required documents (A4size);
⑧ The companies dealing with foreign affairs and individuals must supply all of the following documents:
The companies dealing with foreign affairs:
a: One copy of the Enterprise Business License and Certificate of approval of invested enterprise for the Taiwan, Macao, Hongkong and Overseas Chinese by the People’s Republic of China;
b: One Valid Foreign Labor Permit or one copy of the certificate for investors who don’t need applying for Labor Permit( bring original certificates for inspection);
Foreign Enterprise Permanent Office:
a: One copy of the Foreign Enterprise Permanent Office Registration Certificate in China;
b: One Working Card of the Foreign Enterprise Permanent Office in China and one copy of the Foreigner’s Employment Permit(bring original certificates for inspection).
Aliens Working in Schools:
Institutions should provide: one copy of the Permit of Running a School issued by the Education Bureau of the Guangdong province, Senior-Education Bureau of the Guangdong Province or the Zhuhai Education Bureau
Personnel in schools:
Teacher: one copy of the foreign expert’s certificate (bring original certificates for inspection). Those who teach in an institution that does not award an official degree, a school for training or training center that can’t submit approval from the relevant provincial and municipal authorities should submit one photocopy of the Foreigner’s Employment permit(bring original certificates for inspection).
The only way I can see of getting a Residence Permit with an F visa is if you have a registered company here and have invested a lot of money. In fact if you have your F visa valid for one year and register with the police and get you Residence registration form why do you need a Residence Permit ? You can still rent an apartment just remember,
On move-in day, bring a copy of your pass-port so you and your landlord can go to the local office of the Public Security Bureau to register. The process is quick and free, and if you don’t register you could face a fine of up to RMB 500 per day. You don’t have to state how much you pay in rent when registering, so your landlord need not worry about being forced to pay taxes. It's easy to tie your self in knot over this but it's not that complicated really!
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Thanks Paul so much to learn and will take everything on board now that this is going to be the path I am treading.
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Paul,
you covered everything for the people who are coming here quite well. covers everthing they would need to do.
as far as what Willy is talking about he has the paper from the police station that you need to get and have registered
for were you will be living. its nothing but they have you on file as living at this certain address. even with that paper
you could still be fined 50rmb if you dont have your passport with you but for the most part they wont do that if you
show them this paper. thats all i carry around with me as i leave my passport at home
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Hi Willy,
I'm also confused, nothing new I know. A couple of questions.You have a visa from the PSB, was this given to you after you got married? and is it an L visa. Also what is the "Temporary Residents Permit" you have? Does it actually say" Temporary " and what form does it take a separate book or a sticker in your passport? I understand about having to register at the police station if your not staying in a hotel but I've never come across a Temporary Residents Permit, is it issued by the police? I have a blue " Resident Permit for Foreigners in the People Republic of China" stuck in my passport. While this is valid I do not need a visa of any kind, but to get it I had to have a Z visa that was valid for 1 month! Thanks............
I have a seperate piece of paper. A4 size with all my details in Chinese. Includes my photo. It is headed 'Registration Form Of Temporary Residence For Visitors' and has the Big Red stamp in the centre that makes it 'official'
There is no reference on it as to what visa I have.
It is issued by the police and it is the third one I have had since being here. They come in line with the visa entry in your passport and are valid as long as any visa you have.
They are free!
Willy
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Thanks Willy,
I understand now. Here when you register where your living with the police you don't get issued with any papers at all. They put your name in a big ledger and that's it.
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Willy,
after you got your temp 6 month visa you should have gone down and redid it. i was called down to redo mine
after i guess the papers caught up with each other. now mine matches my visa in my passport.
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There is some confusion about "residence permits" and work permits. and simply registering with the PSB.
Everyone who does not stay at a hotel, will be required to register with the PSB.
A person who simply wishes to stay while NOT working can apply for a "temporary residence permit" such as what Willy has.
A person who is working in China will get a work permit that functions much like a residence permit or as we call them in the US...a green card.
It seems that depending on what website you go to these things are often mixed together and lead to confusion. Even the Chinese embassy in D.C. has conflicting information than its Chicago website...and then you go the PSB site for Zhongshan...and again, conflicting info. Sadly I cannot submit my temp residence permit to the embassy where I apply for my Visa...Sure would be nice to have my residence permit BEFORE I arrive.
Oh well.....seems that I have found enough info and the correct forms to have everything in order once I arrive in October....just in time for some cooler weather....95(F) and rain almost everyday gets old...FAST!
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Just to add to Lain's woe.
The PSB where you renew visa's etc in the centre of Zhongshan. Really busy place where they issue all sorts of Chinese Passports and permits. The Police Station I have to register my residency at is outside of the city limits!!!!
They do not encourage people just to walk in!!!!!!!!
Willy
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Almost got it Lain:-
Everyone who does not stay at a hotel, will be required to register with the PSB............... For this your register at the police station not the PSB.
A person who simply wishes to stay while NOT working can apply for a "temporary residence permit" such as what Willy has....... This is what you get when you register at the police station if you are not staying in a hotel.You have to do this if your working or not. As Willy says, it does not depend on what type of visa you have, its purely to let the police know where your living and that's all. It's a registration document.
A person who is working in China will get a work permit that functions much like a residence permit or as we call them in the US...a green card........You get a z visa( work Visa) to enter the country,this then is turned into a Residence Permit from the PSB. Not to be confused with the one you get from the police station which is a registration document.
Sadly I cannot submit my temp residence permit to the embassy where I apply for my Visa...Sure would be nice to have my residence permit BEFORE I arrive.......... All you ever get is a Z visa to enter the country, If you arrive on an L visa you would have to leave the mainland and apply for it before you could get Residence Permit. Once you have your Z visa you have to 30 days to change it into a Residents permit at the PSB. No way to get a Residents permit on its own. The Z visa lets you apply for a Residents permit. No Z visa ,you can't apply for a Residents Permit.
Z Visa...you need an invitation letter from a company/school. This must be applied for outside of the Chinese mainland unless you pay lots of cash to a dodgy Visa agent here.
Z visa is valid for 30 days, you must change this for a Residents Permit at the PSB. Not the police station different thing.
You would have to be a student, Legal representative of a Foreign firm or a big time investor to be able to change an F visa for a Residency Permit.
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In a way this is all confusing only because I'm not sure what I should be focusing on for I don't know what I will be doing yet? I understand the hotel will register my stay, so I am not worried of that. But lets just say I decide to stay for a few months? (at a residence, not working there) How do you, or who do you talk to, to get what you need? I doubt I would stay that long on a first trip, but there's always that maybe?
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No way to get a Residents permit on its own. The Z visa lets you apply for a Residents permit. No Z visa ,you can't apply for a Residents Permit.
Not too sure about this.. I have had the translator I hired when I was there helping me to so some research and getting some questions answered there in China. It was explained to me that I can get a temporary residence permit on my business (F Visa) for up to 6-months, but no more than 12-months. The permit can be reissued after 6 months, for an additional 6 month term. I can then apply for a 12 month permit after that.
Since I will NOT be working there..at least at a Chinese company, I will not be getting or even need a Z Visa. This is not the ONLY way to get a temporary residence permit.....directly from the PSB via my translator who called on my behalf.
Choices for temp residence application on the form are (Visiting Relatives, Study, Correspondent, Taking Up Post, Family Member, Employment, Seeking Refuge With Family, Purchase Housing, Maintaining Parents, Fosterage, Other)
Registration is required no matter what local police,(if not at a hotel) but only the PSB who will issue the residence permits.
Vince, if your thinking that you might stay longer, I would suggest that you make sure to get a multiple entry 12 month Visa. So long as you stay at a hotel it will be easy, but if your thinking of a longer stay of say 2 months my suggestion would be to seek what is called long stay hotels that are like mini apartments with all the services of a hotel. The best part is that you will not have to sign a long lease or get utilities and all the other crap that goes with an apartment.
I am seeking to stay 6 months at the least, and longer if I can make it all work out so a long stay hotel is simply too pricey for me....but I was quoted a decent price at the Shangri-La hotel which is like a palace compared to how most people live there. they require at least 1-month stay, but have a 2 month deposit requirement. I am sure there are other hotels that offer the same services and others I am sure will offer good deals for monthly rates.
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Lain you are correct when you say there are other routes to get your Residents Permit and maybe I should have said "reasonable" and not "only" in your case,sorry.
"Choices for temp residence application on the form are (Visiting Relatives, Study, Correspondent, Taking Up Post, Family Member, Employment, Seeking Refuge With Family, Purchase Housing, Maintaining Parents, Fosterage, Other)" are you doing any of the above? I still don't understand why you are so hooked into getting a Residence Permit when you have a 12 month multiple entry F visa?
Vince the best way to find out where you would register if your not staying in a hotel is to ask the PSB, they can give you the address of the police station you have register at and there will be someone there who can speak English
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"Choices for temp residence application on the form are (Visiting Relatives, Study, Correspondent, Taking Up Post, Family Member, Employment, Seeking Refuge With Family, Purchase Housing, Maintaining Parents, Fosterage, Other)" are you doing any of the above? I still don't understand why you are so hooked into getting a Residence Permit when you have a 12 month multiple entry F visa?
The MAJOR reason is that I will have to bring one of my computer workstations and a few cases of my business records to run my company while I live in China. While I know that its very unlikely that I will have any problems with re-entry on a Visa....the thought that I COULD be prevented from returning to my apartment where I will have all my possessions is a scary one to say the least.
Its all part of a process with long term goals for eventually staying there for the balance of my life, married or not the process is the same. My current workstation cost over $6500 if you include the software it has running on it...I am NOT going to leave any chance that it may be left behind if I can get a temp residence permit and have some peace of mind during my stay. Besides that its simply a hassle to leave every 30-60 days and re-enter. Since I will actually be there on real business it will also help me keep my travel plans open. I have been contacting many of my current clients, 32 companies in all and much to surprise most of them are interested in having me as a point man on the ground to represent their interests or actually set me up as a distributor in China. Since my company sells textile printing equipment and supplies the market may be huge.
I have built a new remote mirror workstation that will stay here in the US, and will be located at my best friends business where I can use it to run my company should the worst case scenario take place and I am refused re-entry. My laptop is linked to all of them and I can remote control and if need be I can activate a security program that will wipe the system hard drives so my company data will be secure.....but I will still have paper documents that I will not be able to retrieve. So for right now it has more to do with some peace of mind while I operate my business.
Also by getting a temporary residence as soon as I can, it starts the process to gaining extended stays on that permit. If the temp permit is renewed continually for 2 years, I can then request a 2 year permit....after that is renewed for 5 years, I can then apply for a permanent D-Visa that will let me stay for 10 years at a time.....its all about planning long term. Its how I work.
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No problem Lain - just give me the key to your apartment I will keep your workstation greased up by visiting all the sites that I do not want a footprint back to on my PC!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!. ;D
Seriously if you have a problem I can always carry your work station to Hong Kong as we do not need a visa to visit there.
Willy
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No problem Lain - just give me the key to your apartment I will keep your workstation greased up by visiting all the sites that I do not want a footprint back to on my PC!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!. ;D
Seriously if you have a problem I can always carry your work station to Hong Kong as we do not need a visa to visit there.
Willy
If I cannot get the residence permit, I may take you up on the idea....Sadly though, you wont be able to use my computer as I use a Yubikey (http://www.yubico.com/home/index/). This is a USB security key that passes a one time 64 caricature encrypted password to the system boot in order to access the hard drives which are fully encrypted with AES 512-BIT Encryption.
(http://blog.passpack.com/wp/wp-content/uploads/yubikeys.jpg)
No key, no access..., you cant even boot the system without the key, and even if you pull the drives out you cannot break the boot locker without the new password the key has on it. YES.. I am a security freak! But if you had over 15,000 credit cards and company data on over 20,000 customers you would be too!....Not to mention access to my network and dedicated server that controls all 17 of my sites.
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I do understand where your coming from and being safe rather than sorry is always a good strategy. Like you say though I doubt very much that you would have any problems re-entering the country as long as you've been a good boy! I'm not surprised that companies are happy to have a representative here as the business opportunities are huge. I run a sourcing business over here as well as teaching and I'm snowed under with work.
I am still interested in why you think the PSB will give you a Residents Permit. I'm not talking about the official paper Willy has by registering his private address at the police station, but the sticker in your passport.
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before you can apply for a permanent residence visa you have to be here for at least 5 yrs.
then you can apply for that one which is really good for 10 years at a time.
this is what i was told bt the head man at the PSB building in Guangzhou were everyone from
all over comes to and applies for visa's
of course this is for guanggong province and it might be different elsewere but im sure it is the same
for westerners. all the apps from different cities end up here so you might just want to come here and
do yours. it is by Haizhui Square right down from the KFC exit b off the subway and a short walk to the first
major intersection make a right and its on the left hand side after KFC
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before you can apply for a permanent residence visa you have to be here for at least 5 yrs.
then you can apply for that one which is really good for 10 years at a time.
this is what i was told bt the head man at the PSB building in Guangzhou were everyone from
all over comes to and applies for visa's
This is where there seems to be confusion.
There are 2 types of residence permits.
1) One is a "temporary" permit....initially granted for a length of 6 months, but no longer than 12 months.
2) A permanent residence permit, also sometimes called a D-Visa as well, that grants residence for 10 years.
You are correct, I cannot get the 2nd one. However I can with proper planning get the first one as my company "invitation letter" describes my needs as long term research for business opportunities that will require me to be in the country for 6-12 months as I seek business partners and inspect the quality of products for export. I spoke with an international company that am a dealer for and I was told that several of their staff were able to obtain the TEMPORARY permits such as the one I seek. Once issued I will be able to stay for a minimum of 6-months, which will give me some peace of mind and allow me to focus on both my relationship and my business without the hassles of re-entry every month.
One thing that they do weigh on for issuing a permit is my ability to support myself while I am living there. It was told by me that a good gesture that you will be doing business and can pay your bills while there is to have my company open a bank account. I have investigated this as it appears that indeed there is some merit to this, so I will setup an account and transfer $25,000 upon my arrival and before I apply for the residence permit in a good faith effort to prove that I am serious. Besides....I will need a bank account anyway so its not a big deal.
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Lain,
the best bank in China for having an account is ICBC which is the largest bank here and they are everywere. i made the mistake
of using Bank of China and they are everywere but when you are in different cities you will see 7 or 8 ICBC banks before you see
your first Bank of China. So at the end of November when my large note is matured at 1 year i will take all that to ICBC and open
an account there.
remember though opening an account in your city they do charge you if you take money out in another city.
for example you live in Guangzhou and go to Bejing. in Bejing you take 1000 rmb out of your account your bank
will charge you 5 rmb for that transaction.
hope this helps you a little
Ted
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Just for info. I had my application to renew my visa turned down today.
Cause of this was because my wifes temporary permit to live in Zhongshan had expired.
My own visa expires tomorrow Tuesday so I have to leave China before midnight tomorrow or suffer the consequences.
I am leaving tomorrow morning and heading for Macau. I never fancied hong Kong. I understand from the woman at the PSB that Macau is easier to get a 90 day two entry visa from. And it may take only two days.
I have all the details and I now have to face two nights really roughing it in a nice hotel just a stone throw from the two biggest casino's. And a five minute walk from the CTS visa office. As they say it is an Ill Wind etc. or is it every cloud has a silver lining.
Ted knowsthat I was angry as a bee stuck in Robbies ear this afternoon but No 24 hour rule when you are together!!! Still I have apologised.
So renewing your visa makesure everyones paperwork is in order or do not let them go with you.
Willy
Also told that the two year visa is only for business men who have put a lot of money into a business here.
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went to the PSB building today and applied for my resident visa. here are my results. they are only issuing 6 month residence visa's if you dont have a health exam. the 1 year and 2 year visa's are the same price 800 rmb and after i get my exam i will get a two year visa. they told me the different procedures on this depends if your wife is a city citizen and she has to own a house to obtain the 2 year one.
so tommorrow off i go to the hospital and then i return the report to the PSB building with all my paperwork for the processing
and will get everything back in 5 days
just a food for thought for anyone coming here. if your not married with these stipulations then you will get a 6 month one that
you will have to renew every 6 months.
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Perhaps we should have a new thread in line with the 'Gold Diggers' one.
This would involve protecting the women where men come to China and marry them to get hold of there Home registartion book!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Just kidding Ted.
Well I think I am.
Willy
In lively Macao where the night life is great.
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you know that could go both ways Bandit!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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well i have found out that 1 year and 2 year resident visa's are being issued here in China. you can ONLY get a 6 month visa
with NO MEDICAL EXAM. if coming to China and wanting to apply for a resident visa then you MUST get your medical done at an
approved location in your country or all you will get is an l visa for 6 months.
today i went and had my medical and for that they did the following
fill papers out first and make payment 448rmb
go across the street to the hospital that does these
they draw blood first room 1
they weigh and do blood pressure room 2
they check your lymph nodes and probe you and check your back and spine room3
they check your ears.nose throat room 4
they check your eyes room 5
all this on 3rd floor
go to 2nd floor for wxrays
back to 3rd floor
room 5 they do a sonagram
give you a reciept to pick up results in 3 days
if everything ok 2 year visa is issued since i already had a 1 year one
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Back in China today with an extension on my visa.
I went to teh PSB in Zhongshan this aftrnoon and met by favourite officer. I made a note of his name and it is He Wan Kerr.
He had no idea of the new regulations and he was amused when I told hin what Ted had achieved today.
I did ascertain that I could got to Guangzhou to fill in apply for the one or two year visa so I am off to GZ tomorrow for the paperwork and medical and to meet up with the Ambassador. I am dying for those nubile young Chinese nurse to take a hand in things and say 'Cough Please'
So ther PSB in Zhongshan have little English and not much sense of humour. He said I could have a 3 month extension. I told him he himself had given me 6 months previously! But I did raise a slight smile when I said IO would make the journey back to his office if I got a one or two year one to gloat.
Hence the apt name for him.
nyone have any problems with visa then get to Macau. The process there is so easy and you only need to take copies of your ladies papers. I applied 3 pm on Tuesday and collected my visa this morning (wednesday) at 9am and hot footed it back to China.
Cost of travel to and from Zhongshan to Zhuhai 40rmb. Taxi to and from Bus styation to the Zhuhai departure gate for Macau 20 rmb.
Walk from Zhuhai gate to Macacu gate -Free.
Taxi from Macau gate to Beverly Plaza hotel 40 rmb each way.
Hotel is 200 yards from Visa office and 200 yards from Wyns casino. The one shown in all the photos of Macau.
Total travel 140 rnb
Losses in casino last night - that would be telling.
Nice to be home again though
Willy
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damm the plan almost worked 8)
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I was simply aiming at a "starting point" for a 6-month permit. I figure that after my first 6 months I will know for sure IF...
1) I can hack it and adjust to living there. Reality may be very different than perception.
2) IF the lady I am going for is the real deal. I could be wrong but my understanding is that by 6-months, we would most likely be married if its true.
The if the above 2 work as I would like, than I would look into purchasing an apartment and between that, and being married a longer term permit would almost be guaranteed? I am told property ownership weighs heavy on such requests. I was aware of the health screening but had planned to have it done there to save some money. I may re-consider that option as it appears to only be a basic physical with a chest X-ray. Not too sure how it will work to give them my medical records in English?...might have to have them translated for submission?........another question for my translator to research for me.
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having the medical done and then using that after 6 months would be futile and a waste of money on your part
everything needs to be up to and including photos not older than 30 days when you apply for the visa
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http://www.visarite.com/china_tourist_visa.htm# (http://www.visarite.com/china_tourist_visa.htm#)
they also could help in the visa process before leaving if your not close to a chinese consulate
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That was kind of my point....
1) I would get a 6-month permit. See if I can adapt to the new life, see if Jiong Li is as serious as I am.
2) Give it 6 months to see how it goes....see if the relationship will lead to marriage....and if so...
Than find an apartment, but it get married and then apply for the continuation of another 6 month permit and then try for a longer one in the meantime. As I have been stating all along I do have a long term plan...it just that its all premised on the initial 6-month permit. After that I am aware of several ways that I can extend my stay either by the purchase of property, or through commercial business investments. Sadly they do not consider the money that I have to be "substantial" for business....but I have been researching this as well and it can be investment in certain types of industries that can make all the difference....thankfully I am in one such business sector that qualifies for this exception.
I have read several times on other sites that you should have the health exam done there as...
A: Its less expensive (no brainer)
B: Usually they want to have the results in Chinese
C: I have no idea what all the tests are...so let them tell me what, where and when....once I am there.
Also I will be living at a hotel for the first few weeks until I find an apartment, and that will be time enough to go through the process and get the permit (or not) BEFORE I choose to rent an apartment for 6-12 months. I am NOT going to sign a year long lease if I do not get a 6-month residence permit.
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Lain,
its pretty simple --- when you get here register with the local police and then go to the PSB and start the process
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I don't know if anyone mentioned it already. Myself I got a 2 year multi entry visa. I can stay 6 mos per entry. It was pretty easy. Just check a few different boxes on the new application they put out a few months ago. If I need more my wife and I will take a quick trip down to Hong Kong for a few days I want to see it anyway. And now good for another 6 mos.
This works well for me. I do not plan to be a permanent resident. As soon as my wife gets her visa we are off the the USA.
And no matter what I need to do next. I have 6 mos to do it no rush.
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did you get that at the chinese consulate in SAN FRAN before you left?? i always got a 1 year multiple entries
because i always had to go back to the business in the USA but this would have been good now that i dont work
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Oh to be young again!!!! Yesterday I was told by the PSB GZ that over 60 year olds can only get a one year visa.
Willy
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Oh to be young again!!!! Yesterday I was told by the PSB GZ that over 60 year olds can only get a one year visa.
Willy
Willy,
Sounds like you are having trouble keeping up to Ted in the visa department. Maybe you should look for a single young woman that works in the PSB in GZ and start pouring on that british charm and maybe she would give you a 2 year visa. Hehehehe... ;)
Dave C
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im the young one so its easier hahahaha
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You would think after all this time and having had 5 visas now that I would expect the unexpectd in China. But I was caught out today.
Went to collect my visa today 1403 rmb for 12 months is what I was due to pay according to the receipt I received last week.
The gates opened at 2.30 and in the rush I somehow got close to the front of the queue my wife with a little more shoving and pushing got even closer to the cashier desk.
I was there with 1403rmb grasped in my grubby little sweaty paw. ' What is that' I was asked, in Chinese of course. Turns out since I did my last renewal there they no longer take cash. No problem I whipped out by UK debit card. No use. It has to be a bank card and a Chinese one at that.
Ready to head home and try once again to sort out yet another visa fiasco my wife collared the taxi driver and she was stuffing the 1403 rmb into his hand. Thinking that was the dearest taxi ride I had ever had I then found that he in fact had the appropriate card in his wallet.
We pushed our way to the front of the queue again the taxi driver summarily shoved his card into the recepticle. and punched in his number.
There was a bit of confusion when he handed me back 400 off rmb. The punched in the number again.
I obtained the receipt and hotfooted it to the other dept to collect my passport bearing the 12 months visa. WRONG!!!!!
The officer who originally offered me a three month visa gave me a little smile as he handed my passport to me. I opened it and yes your right. It was only for 6 months. He was waiting for me to say something but all I said was 'thank you'. I doubt if he could understand the sarcastic element I put into that.
Well at least it was still double what he had offered me three weeks previous!here
So somewhere between being told it was a 12 month visa at 1403 and my collecting the thing it turn into a 6 months visa at 936 rmb.
I felt very mean having only given him a 10 rmb tip on top of his fare when we got back home. But I also felt very brave indeed having given any tip at all right in front of my wife!!!
Willy
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Willy Willy Willy,
you have had such a bizzare experience with the visa process. maybe they are aware of the
Zhingshan Bandit 8)
maybe the Ambassador needs to pull up out front in the car and have a talk with them :)
see if i could get to the bottom of it for you ;D
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maybe the problem is no medical exam with the forms turned in