Voluntary Emissions Targets

[Vince G]

The biggest CO2 emission are the vehicles in which many exhaust emissions have been lessened over the "years". Catalytic converters on exhausts have been on all autos since about the 70's. This cuts the Co2 emission. Gas and diesel fuels have additives that help cut the emissions down. You can't get fuel that doesn't have it. This last summer started a trade for clunker program. In which you took your old vehicle no matter the shape it's in and got a large amount as a deposit for a new car. Gets the old smokers put to rest. Additional to this is the government against the auto manufacturers. Telling them to start changing the auto's being built to a more "Green" (non emission) friendly. Oh yeah this also goes for buses running daily routes. The previous administration started programs that make fuel from corn (no emissions). Expensive to make but? Or you could take a look at Al Gore's movie that was not just for the US but the world.

We had a emissions problem because we have so many vehicles. As technology grows we have less and less emissions. So saying we don't go to the conventions or block emission control and not doing anything, is flat out wrong.

[shaun]

There has even been talk about doing away with cattle to reduce methane gas emitted into the air.  You might think I am being funny but there have actually been discussions about this.

Shaun

[David5o]

Vince,

I'm basically talking about agreeing to levels, or caps on emissions. When i talked about doing nothing , i was referring to that. The States has consistently refused to abide by agreed future emission levels.

I'm not saying that nothing has been done.

Where vehicles are conserned, i think the whole of the industry has come under fire, and are now doing only as much, as to keep within the limitations they were forced into... The biggest polluters are the big industries, where they fight tooth and nail against any such level reductions that will cost them serious money.  Your lobbyists seems to be wining with your government on these stakes. But sooner or later, the States will have to do something about your industries emissions, but by then, it will cost many many times what it would cost to start implementing improvement now.
That is then going to be the next big excuse of why they can't make the cuts needed by the rest of the world!! It just becomes a vicious circle, where big business rules, and not the government....

David....

[Scottish_Rob]

yes shaun I remember it was on the television news the other week about the gas from cows...

[David5o]

Shaun,

These claims are made by the extremists out there, The Anorak Brigade as i call them. I bet if asked, they'll all be veggies too. They know there not going to get anywhere with the big boy polluters, so they crunch away at every little tom dick and harry, in the hope of taking the world back 150 or more years....

Something like the governments of today, they hammer industries like the aircraft and airlines, because there easy prey. The truth is, that the amount of pollution directly attributed by the airlines is absolutly minuscule compared with the big boys. These industries could have been left alone for the time being, and picked up later on the reduced emissions drive. Even now, the dozy anorak Brigade want the airlines to cut aircraft to a minimum so that you and i would have to pay the earth just to get on a plane.... nutters!! if they had there way, we would be going back to the 30's and traveling everywhere by ship... yeah Right, ...stop the world i wanna get off...

You have to start with the big boys, there the ones that are really polluting the atmosphere, get them in line and the others will quickly fall in line behind them!! ...Not the other way round!!

David.....

[David E]

Wow...this thread could turn into some serious debate about greenhouse gas, global warming and suchlike !!!

I chuck my 2 cents worth here....

Way back in the Cretaceous Period, when dinosaurs ruled, the CO2 levels were 20 to 30 times higher than today's levels.........the result being that the world flourished as never before, because high CO2 is a paradise for plants, hence the world was covered in vegetation from pole to pole. From whence we get all our coal, oil and gas that we use today.

Sea levels were 80 meters higher than now because there was no ice.

The Planet has had many episodes of high CO2 and will continue to get them for millenia to come. The REAL problem is that high CO2 and thus high temperatures raise sea levels....and because we choose to build Cities close to the Ocean, it is very inconvenient for humans to have their Cities flooded !!!!

But Mother Nature dont give a damm.......it will all go on , with or without us !!

CO2 emmission control is a myth, it is simply an untapped, infinite resource for all Governments to generate a Fresh, New stream of Taxation, all done with bleeding heart statements about Global Warming so all us suckers will cry into our beer and be happy that we are once again the mugs who pay for all these grandiose and pointless, futile efforts to control things that are bigger than Politicians.

Sooner or later, Mother Nature, Destiny, or as some would have it...God...will deal with this pestilence on the Planet called humans and will redres the balance. Maybe it will be AIDs, Bird Flu, Swine Flu, Ebola or some such awful pestilence....but one day we will cop it !!!

I can never understand the sheer arrogance of humanity that has to believe that nothing else on this Planet is as important as people !!!! Who, incidentally are the biggest problem on the Planet.

DavidEI will pose another question about Global Warming/emmissions....

If plants absorb CO2 and give off Oxygen as part of the process of photosynthesis...by which we get oxygen to breathe......

And if we are chopping down forests at an alarming rate, and clearing land for housing and industry at an even bigger rate, thus removing much of the vegetation that provides our oxygen

If then at the same time we are breeding more and more people and more and more animals to feed these people...thus producing more and more organisms who need oxygen.

And if we are producing more and more CO2 as a result of these processess..........from less and less plants able to provide oxygen

Why then aren't the oxygen levels on the planet falling ?
In fact, oxygen levels are slowly rising !!!

Queer aint it

DavidE

[Rhonald]

David I am out of breath after reading you comments. Good food for thought, or should that be - your ideas are like a fresh breath of air. Your thoughts also reminds me of an article refering to the methane levels put out by the millions of buffalo that once roamed America when certain political groups were saying that our desire for beef products was not green house friendly. Maybe these same political groups thought that the reckless slaughtering of the great herds of buffalo was doing the plant a good service :-/

[shaun]

David E,

I agree with you and I will have to think about your question a while.

Here is another question I have had and I am not the originator of this question.  If global warming is such and catastrophic issue, why were several global warming conferences canceled last winter due to snow storms?

Hmmmmm...........
It makes you think.......

Shaun

[David E]

Yes, we are being bombarded, bullied and blitzed by ONE viewpoint only, and that is the one that suits the Political Agenda.

There are thousands and thousands of eminent, credible and qualified Scientists out there who hold totally different opinions about the whole issue...but they never get heard because it would spoil the Political Party and maybe prejudice this new and juicy Taxation River that will flow from "Save the Planet ". Naturally, media and TV wont give them any air time...sells many more papers and TV ad. time if doom and gloom prevails !!!!
If you really want to have an informed debate, go and look at the writings of the Lavoisier Society...then make up your own mind about it all !!!!

Incidentally, David50......The USA choses not to committ to unrealistic CO2 reductions because it is the only Government that realise that it will be so punishing to Industrialised Society to get any sort of compliance. Because all the "less developed" countries are bleating that they cant do anything because of economic poverty.

Stupid Australia...with less than 20 million people is preparing to massacre Australian Industry and charge us poor sods for the privilege by a new carbon tax that will add something like 30% to each of our annual tax bills. Already our electricity prices have been put up 50%, yes 50% as a "subsidy to offset CO2 emissions from Power generation".

You aint seen nothing yet !!!! wait till these bl**dy politicians really get going !!!!!

DavidE
Rhonald

You are exactly right in what you say...the world, historically, before we came along and stuffed it up, supported untold millions of Oxygen Breathing, CO2 emitting, Methane farters...and the planet flourished. Lush forests grew everywhere, the climate was warm and balmy, the sea levels were at maximum...life was good then

Along came Adam and Eve...been all downhill since then (hahahaha)

DavidEShaun

You well know my religious leanings so I wont go on about it here....

But...there is ONE significant thing that the Bible got dead right...and that is the Armaggedon...the time when mankind will face the reckoning over what he has done to this beautiful world and what we have done to destroy compassion, love for fellow man and is visible in the mountain of corruption, drug pushing, moral decay and rabid consumerism and posturing that we have allowed to evolve..

Only one way can we completely wreck this Planet, that is by nuclear anihilation, other than that, we will one day find out that the Universe is bigger than us ...and the World will go on !!!...maybe the cockroaches WILL take over

DavidE

[Vince G]

You have to start with the big boys, there the ones that are really polluting the atmosphere, get them in line and the others will quickly fall in line behind them!!

Dave all the industries here have been regulated since the 70's. Spot inspections a few times a year. Filters in place for any emissions from there stacks.

As it was mentioned, methane gas emitted from garbage dumps are vented into a pump and sold to the local electric companies.

In all they are doing something. It's not easy to get away with, with so many eyes. But seeing and reading of the haze over China? I go back to my original statement, telling them to clean it up.

Wow...this thread could turn into some serious debate about greenhouse gas, global warming and suchlike !!!

And if we are chopping down forests at an alarming rate, and clearing land for housing and industry at an even bigger rate, thus removing much of the vegetation that provides our oxygen.

Dave E, I agree with most of what you said. Many places here do not allow taking trees out. You may if you replace them. As in moving them over to build. Then there are national parks where no trees (or anything else) can be touched. I'm not talking of a few acres these places are immense.I'll add I think global warming is BS. Showing glaciers edges falling? Ah that's what they do? A glacier is a slowly moving mass or river of ice. So yeah parts break off. For those that did see Al Gores movie... the glacier shown in it was taken from another movie and was computer animated. So it was FAKE. The earth and mother nature will do what it does when it does, sooooo.
I also have my own theory on ice melt but I haven't tested it yet. It will prove them to be BSers

[Scottish_Rob]

"...Yes, we are being bombarded, bullied and blitzed by ONE viewpoint only, and that is the one that suits the Political Agenda...."

David I couldn't agree more with this statement, BUT, isn't that the case for everything...Everything id done to SUIT Political agendas:s