Trouble in Paradise part deux

[ttwjr32]

Vince,

i do agree with you whole heartedly  if i remember correctly she is divorced
and Philip had already sent her 5 or 6 thousand pounds a few months back.
Phillip needs to tell her im sorry its not going to happen. i am not sending any
money for your ex. PERIOD!!!  and i wouldnt use the brother on this one as it
needs to come from Phillip and not him. if she wants to tell her brother then
she can do that but i am afraid she is scamming him, they do scam you and
you think they love you even when you meet take the blinders off tell her NO
and see what happens if she doesnt contact him back then you know. i talked
to my wife about this and she just smiled and said something i dont think i need
to put here but i will say part of what she said--- many women in china do this--
they are poor and are looking for money--   not all but some do take the time to
set it all up to get a large payday.

[Willy The Londoner]

I don't know if your a gluten for punishment? or not. You can't be that desperate or in Love with her that you let her do this to you? :@

Come On Vince and others  -this is not someone who has not met his lady - he has. He has had an emotional attachment to her.  If it was you would you just say - thats it finished without another thought?  I doubt it very much and that same sentiment applies to the rest who have or were going to write in the same vein.  It is very easy for others to say just 'ditch the bitch' no offence to you and your lady Phillip but this is basically what some are saying.  

He came on here asking for advice from the sages. I have given my view earlier - I said the decision is his in the end but I gave what I thought was advice good or bad it was advice.  If others have got nothing else but 'ditch her' in mind then there is no point in adding that to this thread.  That is not advice - it is like Pontius Pilate washing his hands and leaving it to the crowd.

OK I may lark around and take the piss out of people but when it comes to caring I do.    I do care a Brother could be on the verge of losing someone they are in love with.     I do care when other brothers who have  been talking to ladies for months and months suddenly find they are not the person the lady wants.    I do care that my wife is wondering what I am getting irate over so I had better stop now.

Willy

[Vince G]

I've had enough of this right here in the US. As soon as the "I need" comes up? I say good for you. Meaning your not getting it from me. My ex thought me a good lesson. A 7 year scam. So I've been there done that. Only because of the kids did I stay and tried.

So my experience is making me shout out to others. Hope they listen.

[ttwjr32]

Willy,

i do realize he met her and has feelings but come on this lady just needs
to be told  no i am not paying this to the ex   yes i would do that if it were
me.  then the ball is in her court but you have to keep your feet on the
ground and let her know that its not going to happen and see what she does
if it were me i wouldnt even negotiate the amount at all  anyway its not me
and philip needs to decide his own fate

Ted

[metooap]

Hi guys,
I need some sage advice.
I was all set to get married to my lady in April. I have all the right paperwork. I am also applying for jobs in China. I have an interview tomorrow in Liverpool for a teaching job at the British School in Beijing. Good job, British wages. But the course of true love never runs smooth.
My lady suggested to me a few days ago that we might want to wait a few years???!! to get married. My initial reaction was that she was getting cold feet. She has the habit of hiding important facts from me, because she doesn't want to worry me and wants to handle them herself.
It turns out that her ex-husband has placed impossible conditions on her in the divorce settlement last December. She says that the person who instigates divorce proceedings has to pay the other party. And her ex-husband wants 500000 yuan from her. She thinks she can get him down to 120000. I think I can get him down a back alley and rearrange his face. I don't really understand what is going on, what she has signed, what the court says, whether she has to pay the money after two years, whether we can be married after that time and avoid paying this. She has only just told me. I know she has been stupid and naive in this process. She has not been sleeping, her whole family have been very critical of her, blaming her for what she is doing to me. They are normally very supportive, but they have given her a hard time. I am being supportive, telling her I am glad she has been upfront with me and saying that we will sort things out together.
I have suggested speaking with her brother, who has helped us in the past. He would probably know about the legal issues, or know someone who knows. He is more on my side than hers at the moment, even though he is her brother. But she received such a blasting from him, that she wants him to cool down before letting me speak with him. Personally, I think this needs sorting. However ill-advised she has been, I know she was doing it for us. I will try and contact him as soon as I've persuaded her.
I don't know if anyone knows the legal issues in this kind of situation, but I know her ex would not be asking for such an obscene amount of money if I were Chinese.
Much as I would love to consign the ex to the dustbin of history, there is no way I can afford, or am willing to pay anything like that amount. If I was working for Chinese wages, I'd have to work for about 150 years to earn that.
Any advice would be gratefully received. I will update you when I know more. As it stands, it looks like my third single certificate is going into the recycling.

Philip,

Most people here are pretty level headed. Normally on an issue, you will get a cross section of opinions. On this issue, everyone here is pretty much saying the same thing.

I know you may be taken back by this person. What i did not know was that you have already sent her a sizable amount of money.

You should stop your losses right now - unless as has been so aptly put, you are gluten for punishment.

You did not post this issue, because you are a fool. You posted because internally - you already know the deal. We are simply serving as a sounding board - for what you really already know. This is not a good situation.

It is certainly you call what to do - how to handle this situation - but you probably already know exactly what to do.

[Arnold]

So ... may I add , that we have alway's and from the beginning of this and the Facebook Forum have said ... if asked for Money " RUN " . Now if met Face to Face , does that really make a difference ? Yes it does , your just get Hooked even more and most likely for more Money . Which is what I see here .
I know exactly how hard it must be for Phillip ( maybe I don't ) , but it is His dicision to make . We hope it will be the right one , as we hate to see it happen to one of our Brother's here or anybody for that matter .

[David E]

With particular reference to Willy's post...

It is not unusual to develop an attachment to a scammer...thats all part of the plan. It just makes the decision to bolt a lot more difficult.

But what is the use, practically and emotionally of persisting with a relationship where the Lady has clearly put a demand on the table for an absurd amount of money that very few Men....Chinese or Western would be able to find ??

How can it be possible to consider that such a Lady has only love on her agenda...what would the future hold under these circumstances. What, indeed is her "excuse"or logic to ask for such a sum....bearing in mind the previous request for a 200,000 RMB wedding ?? added to the fact that the Chinese divorce Laws would only require her to pay such momey to her ex-husband IF all the assets were in her name and the "500,000" was to pay him off with his share.....can you see that happening in China !!!!

Willy, of course you and all of us here would love to see and help to manage a happy ending for Philip, that goes without saying.

But it is nice when we stop beating our head against the wall...the headache goes away. !!

Willy, I think you are not doing the right thing by Phiip, you are prolonguing the myth. It is shurely 100% obvious that he cant win this one.

Better an emotional pain for a while than bancrupcy and a lifetime of regret. We all know that there are many, many wonderful Ladies out there in China...why persist with this disaster in the making...it is cruel to lead Philip on

David E

[ttwjr32]

absolutely David  it will be hard but cut and run this lady is all
about money and when backed in the corner changes the story
like the wedding money and now has come up with this. my instincts
tell me that everyone is involved and looking for a payday so be wary
of all involved.

we all want great endings here but there comes a time when you have
to look at the facts and large amounts of money is what she seems to
ask for. tell her absolutely not under any circumstance and see what
happens. if she cuts and runs then it was a setup for money. if she stays
see what happens in the future

[maxx]

I'm almost in agreement Ted.Except for the last part of you post.The damage has ben done.No trust is left.You will always be thinking what will she try next.Sic mother sic water buffalo.Heater don't work.Pick your excuse and just send the money.

It is Phillips decision at the end.But like I said before.If it was me.I would of already kicked her to the curb.And moved on to a kinder gentler place.Ted As you know this is a long journey.With allot of twists and turns in the road.

With a women like this.Already after the money.I can't see it getting any better.

[ttwjr32]

Maxx,
you left out the mercedes with all the extreme options that
you can get in an auto.

car cost----- 45,000
extras--------40,000

its all just bad and its a shame but it is reality
i went thru this with my first chinese lady but
all she got was a green card so i wasnt out the
cash. but i was a little embarresed with some of
the things she did with immigration to show she
didnt do fraud but that it was all my fault. as the
immigration lady told me in our phone conversations
this happens all to often as they have a plan and
immigration just allows them to stay after all is said
and done because of the cost involved to send them back

i wanted the fraud issue pushed but they wouldnt do it
just told me to chalk it up to experience and to be careful
if i do it again

[David5o]

Ted,

I don't know how it works in the USA, but in the UK and also probably in Europe too, is that ''Your'' responsible for all and any costs of repatriation if immigration is not happy about (in our case) the ladies motives, or any deviance from the rules of the visa they have been awarded.
So i don't know what costs, that the US immigration lady you talked too, was referring too!!! Truth be known, just can't be bothered to do her job, too much paperwork for her...lol!!

David......

[ttwjr32]

she was most helpful in her 2 phone calls with the first one being as to
why i wrote an 8 page letter to immigration and ICE. i told her it was because
i was used and if i really wanted to push it i could but she understood were i
was coming from. if she had scammed me for money they would have stepped in
right away but she didnt get money except for the immigration costs. she did ask
why i did the letter and i told her that i will return to China and if i met another one
i didnt want them to think i was an idiot. she said they will put it in my file. now i
would like them to find that file lol if i need it. but i did keep the phone transcripts
copy of my letter and summaries of the time and date and the context of what we
spoke about on the phone. the lenth of time of the call to my cell phone bill backs up
the conversation we had which was lenthy in both instances.

[odysseus007]

Maxx,
you left out the mercedes with all the extreme options that
you can get in an auto.

car cost----- 45,000
extras--------40,000

weekend at the Ritz------50,000
toothpaste & other necessities----15,000
fees for the private banker----20,000
flying out to meet Wendy Teng on her yacht----30,000
:icon_cheesygrin:

[shaun]

Phillip,

If you want to continue with her I would suggest you take the job and live with her a good long while.  This not something I would suggest to everyone.  There may be something much worse going on here that you will only find by being there but then again it could simply be that it is her showing her doubt again.  It is so hard to tell with a few lines on a computer screen.  You need to decided how far you are willing to go to keep her with you.  I don't thing you will get to the core of these issues from England, it needs to be up close and personal.

Shaun

[Philip]

Thank you everybody for your posts. If I didn't have the same doubts as you, I would not have started this thread. I have been too trusting at times, but like has been said a few times, where is a relationship without trust? I have not had all of the information, but like has also been said, Chinese women do not tell you everything. Sometimes they do not tell you anything. I have been guilty of letting my heart rule my head at times, but I do trust her, for better or for worse. I don't know if it is significant, but she has told me of this ridiculous situation now, rather than after we had been living together for months. Does this mean she is honest or dishonest?
Anyway, my head and my heart have spoken and have given her a practical ultimatum.
1. I will not give her husband one penny, one red cent, one silver yuan.
2. As we planned to have a child, if I had to stay in England, we would have to get married now, otherwise she would not be able to come to England. And if she could not come to England, we would not be able to have a child. I'm not waiting for 3 years and I know she would not want to have a child when she is 40, which is how old she will be in three years.

So, I am not running away. But I have given her my decision. If she says no, I will have to end it. In the end, it comes down to practicality, I would not be able to support a family and pay extortion money at the same time. Simple.

If her reply is in the negative, then I will have to end it. Then I have a flight to Guangzhou on the 5th April to take and a two-week holiday in which I may gatecrash some Ted and Willy parties. Watch this space.