As we didn't have enough to worry about ?

[maxx]

I do agree with David E and Paul.This can and will be a living hell without some kind of support.When I went threw this.Thiere wasn't allot of information out thiere.This forum wasn't here.Chnlove's forum was a joke.With allot of miss information.So it was real tough.And I don't suggest anybody to do it the way I did.

Also for the reason stated by the other brothers.The western woman has worked them selves into a position.Where most men are not interested in dealing with.A western women's attitude.So they do go outside of thiere own country or customs.To look for a wife.

I think I have it figured out why the divorce rate is allot lower.With a mixed marraige.The main reason I think is because with a mixed marraige.You have more at stake then you do with a traditional marraige.You have all the time and effort to find the right woman for you.You have the custom and culture issues.The laungage issues.You are looking at 6 months to a year.or better to even get your new wife to your country.And lets not forget How bloody expensive this is.

So in my case.I try very hard not to treat this marraige.like I did my previous relationships and my first marraige.I actually do listen closely to what my wife is trying to tell me.Because she still has problems with English.I pay closer attention to her body laungage.I try to be sensitive.To the custom and culture differences.And I now have infinite patience.When she doesn't understand what I'm trying to tell her.And I try to remember if it hadn't ben for me.My wife wouldn't have to deal with the day to day issues of living in a foreign country.

I think if you have to work this hard to make something like this work.You take better care of it.Then you would.If somebody else just gave it to you.I don't care who you are.Or what god you pray to.You are going to be setting alone one night.While the wife and the kids are sleeping.And think to yourself.F**k this woman came half way around the world.Left her family and friends.And everything else she ever knew.Just to be with your raggedy ass.And the hope.That you will be a good person and a good Husband.You really have to respect a woman who would do all that just for you.

[David E]

Right on Maxx....

To "flesh-out" this debate a bit, I would add that we have no choice but to spend a year or more, communicating with our Chinese Wife, on QQ or such, with email, phone and all, and every so often we get to spend a few precious weeks together in person, before we are able to take up life as a married couple. This is a very fundamental contrast with the sort of relationship we may have with a local woman.
During this time we have the ever present language issues, the difference in culture and tradition.

When you have got through these hurdles, you get to realise that you have both invested heaps and heaps in your future relationship, and if you were not serious, it never could have survived the journey !!!...and having survived and grown during the journey, is the stronger because of it.

I never considered myself much of a patient Man, but over the past year I have learned and learned and learned to be both patient and sensitive as I watch my lovely Lady bust her ass to learn a new language, prepare herself wholeheartedly to leave job, friends and family to come to live in a foreign land that is completely alien to her previous way of thinking and living.
At the same time, she is always supporting me and giving me heaps of encouragement and accolades for being the best LG (our Chinglish...she is LP and I am LG)
This woman will only have me in the future, to be the one who will be responsible for her transition to this new life...it is a sobering, humbling and at the same time delightful responsibility.

I never before put anything like the effort into a relationship as I am doing with this one...and it feels good. I cannot honestly say I could be bothered to do the same for the average woman I might meet locally...it would not be appreciated, understood or valued !!!

So do I cherish this relationship above all else....you bet!!!, and that is why in some way it is safer and more real than any other...and I know it will last. We will go through a very hot fire...to be together, but we will make it work...because we want to do it...together.

Those Bros who went before have prepared the way for the rest of us with knowlege and support. Those of you starting out on this journey...know you are not alone and there is always someone here to help...with both real practical advice when needed...and sometimes with advice you dont want to hear.

Either way, it makes it all a bit more doable   

David

[ttwjr32]

These are all valid points. And what about us guys who give up everything to move to China? Should
we expect them to do the same for us? Or just have us turn Chinese and forget were we had come from.
I would like to hear some comments on this topic. This might be interesting.

[maxx]

Ted you and the other brothers who live in China.Have Chosen a different path.As far as your wives are concerned.You still have the same job the rest of us do.You just have to figure out how to do the job in a different country.Which I'm sure can be kind of tough in another country.Especially if you do not speak.The laungage well.And you also have to figure out how everything works.Different country different customs.

We can break it down.Love honor,Trust.These should all be real easy to do anywhere in the world.And everybody hear knows what the words mean.So I won't explain them.

Lets just skip over that part.And get to the heart of the matter.Why do you think your wife agreed to marry you? I don't think it was for a green card.I don't think it was because you are the most handsome man she has ever seen.I don't think it was for instant wealth and popularity.With her friends,Family and the neighbors.

I do think it was for love.and support financially and emotionally.She has had a bad day at the office.She knows your at home waiting for her.She is supposed to be able to talk to her best friend.And tell him what is on her mind.And her best friend is not supposed to pass judgment.Her best friend is supposed to be thiere.To comfort her console her.And help her battle all the evil things in her life.

The financial support.She is going to come up a little short on money this month.And all your wife can see is the daily grind.Not being able to pay the bills.No money for food.And no chance to rise above the humdrum.Of everyday life.This is where you come into the picture.You both should have the same bank account.You should be adding money to the bank account.And planning.Your next great adventure together.Giving your wife something to look forward to.Thiere should be no secretes between you and your best friend.If thiere are secretes.Or if one partner has a hidden agenda.Then thiere is going to be problems.At sometime during the relationship

And with a Chinese woman the special things don't have to be big or expensive .With my wife.It is Chinese food every Saturday.That she doesn't have to cook.Walks along the river.Going driving threw the mountains.At least one trip a year to China.If my wife wants to buy.Clothes or something special for herself or the kids.My reply is ok.Do you want to do it now.Or do you want to go latter.

Ted it all boils down to just supporting.Your wife.Just like they supports us.I do the daily grind in the states.Does it piss me off my wife doesn't work.No not in the least bit. she is home every time I came home.She has her own special smile reserved for me.And I get to see it everyday.She tries to force feed me food as soon as I step threw the door.She drops whatever she is doing.And tries to make me comfortable.It is me and my wife.Against the world.And we reassure each other of that everyday.

Ted the age of the lady your married to.Says she is probably traditional.Which means.You are the hunter.And the protector of the family cave.My wife is the same way.I make the money for the family.I do all the repairs to the cave.I protect the cave.She keeps the cave clean.She takes care of the kids 90% of the time.And makes sure that I'm not anoid.Or uncomfortable.When I come home from work.

If you are trying to break your wifes traditions.It is going to cause you nothing but grief.Ted as long as you and your wife have ben married.99% of the time.your wife doesn't even remember that  she is married to a foreigner.How do I know this? Because I forget all the time.That I'm married to a Chinese woman.Yes I know she eats food.I wouldn't even think about eating.She does some strange things.That most Americans don't do.And she has got this strange accent when she speaks English.

What I do know is my wife is my best friend.I know she looks to me to provide a safe and comfortable place to live.And she looks to me to provide the money so that her and the kids can eat.Be warm and comfortable.And she relies on me to be her best friend.And stand with her.No matter what it is.Weather it is here or in China.

[Scottish_Rob]

These are all valid points. And what about us guys who give up everything to move to China? Should
we expect them to do the same for us? Or just have us turn Chinese and forget were we had come from.
I would like to hear some comments on this topic. This might be interesting.

I would say that Maxx is 100% right...When the shoe is on the other foot (the women going to your country) is giving up most of their customs/traditions, then surely, WE can do the same.  We don't have to turn Chinese, in our hearts we KNOW were we came from, be it USA/Canada/UK/Australia..whereever.  I just know that I have travelled half way around the world to meet this lady, and I want to stay here.

Will I turn Chinese if I stay,?... NO CHANCE, I'm Scots and always will be, it is JUST MY outlook that will change NOT my heart.  But you do have a valid point Ted!!!

[David E]

Good point Ted !!!

But Man is supposed to be the "provider"...especially in Chinese society. So when you made the decision to move to China to be with your wife, you did not lose the requirement to be the Head of your family...only you will do it in her country, not yours.

I am sure that your wife is very much aware of the importance of your decision, and you have spared her a serious lot of trouble and angst that she would have got had she moved to America.

But in the final crunch, you decided to go down your own track...together....and that is the best definition of a good relationship....it matters little where the physical geography is, as long as you both are comfortable with it.

Having said that, I agree with Rob...living in China compells you to change your lifestyle and to some extent your behaviour...but it can never change who you are and what you have come from.

I have been in Aus many, many years...my kids are 100% Aussie...but I will always retain my own English heritage, however much I love this country ...I think the same for you (and all the others who have done the same)....as they say "you can take the man out of the country, but you cant take the country out of the man" 

David

[Jimmy]

Wow what a good read. It made me think a lot. And I have realized that 100% of the opposition I was getting for having a Chinese Wife was coming from American women.
And everyone of these women are lonely and unhappy gold diggers. They were able to plant a lot of doubt in me that has never gone away. I have always just tried to over look it, and sometimes it is really hard. But after reading this I think now I better understand why they tell me these things. I guess I knew it all along but somethings have been said here that have helped finally put it all together. So Thank You My Friends.

And I would mention that we really can't stereotype the guys living in China either. Every one of us are here for a different reason in common. In Common we are all here to be with our wives, that is obvious. Some are here to teach it is really what they want to do. Others are teaching because they don't want to wipe out the capital they started with, so the earn so they can leave that original pile of cash alone.
And then their are the guys like me, I have no intention of staying here forever. I am here to be with my wife. To help her learn some English and just be with her through her Interview and to escort her home when it is time to go. Her English has gotten much better but still not good. To show it is a marriage based on Love. We don't have 1000 pictures, and we have not done all the traveling together that most of the guys have done. We save receipts but not religiously.
January 13 I arrived in China. The next morning I married my wife. A few days later we rented an Apartment together. And all but 12 weeks this year we have lived in it together. And all the Stamps in my passport will prove it. I have not spent 1 single night in China that my wife was not with me.
In my head that should be plenty of proof in itself.
As most of you know I have a heart problem, I had to spend 7 days in a Chinese hospital. and other than to go to use the bathroom my wife was at my side every minute. She fed me washed me did anything I need. Man if that isn't Love I don't know what is.  Just this very minute she walked passed me, saw a small spot on my shirt. Pulled it off of me, telling me that shirt is dirty I must wash it now. An American woman no way would she do these things I see it as love. The American woman see's it as stooping to a lower level.
These American women have no idea what equal rights are, Because what they really want is extra rights. They don't want to work and be equal to the man. They want men to take 2 steps  back and give it to them. The US Government I won't even get started on that. Bashing the USA is not allowed here. But if it were, I would be willing to bet most of the guys doing it would be Americans.
Anyway I kind of got off track here. Anyway thanks for the good Info I am happy to say this is a thread that has truly been helpful for me.
 

[Paul Todd]

China can be a frustrating place to live,if I said it didn't put a strain on Ming zhi and my relationship at times I would be lieing. It's how you deal with the problems that arise that makes all the difference,but that's true anywhere in the world.
 
When I moved over here a little over a year ago now I didn't think I was giving anything up. In fact quite the opposite, I thought I was gaining a hell of a lot. We both knew at the beginning that we came from different cultures, just how deep that went took me a while to find out! I don't want or need to become more Chinese and she doesn't need to become more western,we love and laugh about the differences all the time but bottom line is, we are man and wife and that's the same everywhere. Same rights and the same responsibilities. In some ways I feel less stressed because my wife is surrounded by her family and friends and it's me that has to deal with the differences rather than the other way round. For better or worst,richer or poorer I think the words go. It doesn't matter where you are as long as your committed and faithful to each other.

We share everything together nothing is mine or hers, it's ours. We discuss any problems we have with life in general or with each other and share our hopes and dreams. If one of us has a bad day we know the other is waiting and can be relied on to listen and as Maxx pointed out not to judge but to support. When she is at work she tells me she's thinking about me and can't wait to get home and when I finish at school there she is waiting to drive me home. There are no secrets or hidden agenda's between us and we enjoy each others friendship and company. We most certainly don't take each other for granted and even after a year I still can't believe she is my wife!

If your marriage has a sound base then it would take a lot to break that bond with a Chinese woman. They are fiercely loyal and one thing I can say without doubt is that my wife wants our marriage to be a success and will do everything in her power to make that happen and I am the same. What a refreshing difference from my first time around!  Is it perfect? defiantly not, but it's not that far away from it either!

Whatever we earn in a month goes into the same pot and she deals with all the expenses, what ever is left she diligently squirrels away in our joint bank account. As for living here or the UK or where ever that is a decision we will take together if and when we decide to make it something we have decided needs action. There's a lot of China I want to see and a lot of Europe and the US she would like to see too, they are not mutually exclusive and we are in no hurry.

To see it in terms of what you are losing or giving up instead of what you gain is a huge mistake in my opinion, but then again I've always been the glass is half full sort of guy. I honestly believe that this whole adventure has made me a better person as has my wife,not by laying down rules which as a point of principal I tend to rebel against anyway but just by ......well I'm not quite sure, but all you guy's with Chinese wives know what I'm trying rather badly to say!

[ttwjr32]

 Paul,

That is well said.That is exactly how it should be in these relationships and should not be met
halfway. When i said turn chinese what i meant was control issues that some people have. And
you shouldnt let yourself fall into that with a lady from here.

It should be of mutual agreement not based on some saying or tradition. Sounds like you and Ming
have a good handle on this and that was what i was trying to convey here.

China is not the easiest country to live in and the money you bring here should stay in the bank for a
rainy day and you should live on what you make and plan from that. There is always a better road ahead
and that road should be waited upon for the two of you. Not used all up now and left with nothing.

Its interesting you have a joint account because i know of some who got a cold reception on that and then
told others a different version of what is happening. If your not going to have a joint account to work together
with then what do you have? seperate accounts.

That doesnt make it bad but i really think it should be like you guys have it. Its a good formula for success.
Anyway just wanted to see what others thought on this because if you were living in your country then everything
would be joint no this is mine this is yours thats how i always did it.